Throttling RTMP to Twitch

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Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 6,111

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

 

Thank you.  Baring any huge differences in how twitch RTMP data is treated by Rogers vs Start, that lays the blame on the modem.



Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 6,111

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

@RogersShaun nope, this is an engineering issue that will take concerted action by Rogers and Twitch Engineering staff to sort out.  From what I can see there's nothing that I or Tech Support can do at this point in time.  Using a VPN appears to be a workaround, which points to the fact that as long as the modem doesn't know that the data stream is RTMP based, then its quite satisfied to run it with any VPN data rate restrictions found in the Puma 6 and 7 firmware.  As I've indicted before, this will take a test session or two with Rogers and Twitch Engineers, with full access to the modem and network in order to trace the data from the customer's modem, thru the network and finally to the Twitch servers.  Even then, it will result in a list of actions that have to be completed to ensure that RTMP streaming works on the Rogers network, not only for Twitch, but also for Youtube and others.  That customer will have to be a volunteer, willing to run a test stream and provide any tech details required by the Rogers and Twitch Engineers.  Just a guess, this might take a few hours via three way conference call to accomplish.  

 

The one nagging problem here is that no one appears to have details on hand that spell out specific data rates for the various protocols that the modems might encounter.  There are known issues with data rates for non-TCP/IP,ICMP or UDP traffic.  So, someone in the Engineering Staff needs to take the bull by the horns and sort this out as its an issue not only with streaming RTMP, but also with VPNs and with IPSEC traffic.  My personal thought is that these issues might date back to the 2007/2008 timeframe when the Puma 5 was first developed by Texas Instruments.  Intel bought the Puma product line from Texas Instruments in 2010, and possibly carried on any limitations by simply porting portions of the firmware to both Puma 6 and 7 modems, both of which have problems with out of the ordinary protocols. 

 

At the end of the day, Rogers will have to make some pronouncement that they are, or are not interested in running protocols other than run of the mill TCP/IP, ICMP and UDP.  Users these days expect much more out of their services, from streaming to VPNs to IPSEC and others.  I'm sure that TPIAs are more than willing to step in if Rogers prefers to stay out of the game. 



Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 1,076

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch


@Tal3 wrote:

Although I'm not abel, I'm having the same issues where the stream will be rock solid for a few min, completely go to 0kb/s then recover and go back to rock solid. I'm on the CODA4852 modem and I recently switched over from Start where I had Zero problems streaming.

 

This is my SNB info: 

 

sndb.PNG

 

and this is my Twitch inspector info:

 

TI.PNG

 

As you can see, it flatlines throughout the entire stream and essentially freezes the stream, but the sound goes through. It's a wired connection with no extra routers or bridges or anything of the sort.


@Tal3

as @Datalink mentioned, the issue is in Rogers Routing. However, your signal levels are very weak, and the SNR numbers are low. I would suggest sending a PM to @CommunityHelps asking them to check your signal levels and SNR, then to compare to your neighbours to see if your low levels are neighbourhood wide, or only affecting your modem. 

 

Either way they should send a tech out to improve the SNR levels. 

 



I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 14

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

So I just wanted to add that I signed up for the trial firmware process and am now on 2.0.10.33T3 firmware and the problem still persists, so unfortunately I may have to drop the service and just pick up another Modem, shame.

I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 14

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

this RTMP issue seems to affect only the coda 4582 and not the CGN3 family of modems despite the fact that they both run intel puma chipsets. i believe a similar issue was experienced in older firmware on intel puma systems where the modem would drop packets on large long running data streams. https://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/12/03/intel_puma_chipset_firmware_fix/

I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 14

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

Would there be a way to get the CGN line of modems?

I've Been Here Awhile
Posts: 3

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

I'm waiting on my new lan card in 2 days since when I look at most people that have this problem most of them got killer network adapters so I'm a rule out that before I go in further details and since I heard of some people changing helped I don't want to waste no ones time you know but here is my levels anyways

modemsettings.GIF

I've Been Here Awhile
Posts: 3

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

I decided to check out vpn expressvpn started streaming 0 drop frames after over an hour of streaming disconnect connected to a different server ran for an hour 0 drop frames to twitch wow I can't believe those guys were right vpn fixes all the problem streaming to twitch tested it at 6k bitrate by the way not the 3k bitrate I was doing before when I was dropping metic tons of frames ever min or so 

I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 39

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

Im tired of this issue, not being able to stream as a full time streamer, if anybody else had any suggestions for a different ISP please PM me, new to Canada and don't know much about ISPs.

 

Was looking at start and bell

I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 41

Re: Throttling RTMP to Twitch

I don't Twitch or stream RTMP but this thread disturbs me: is this a violation of net neutrality?  I know @Datalink says that this topic is inappropriate, but I'd like to try to analyze this.

 

Are some people with this problem using the modem in Bridge mode? From here on, I'm only going to talk about systems where the modem is in bridge mode.

 

In bridge mode, the modem should not be examining packets, except for destination address.  All packets should take the same fast path.  No protocol should have different performance characteristics through the modem.  There is no room for microcode bugs here.

 

If VPNs solve the problem, why?  And which kind of VPN?  Each type of VPN has different kinds of packets.  Most of IPSec traffic is ESP or UDP, if NAT traversal is used.  Most of OpenVPN traffic is TLS.  Neither of these should be treated specially by a modem in bridge mode.  But if Rogers throttles this upstream (doing so would violate net neutrality too, but this is claimed by some posts in this thread), it could prevent the modem from being overwhelmed (an unintended consequence).  It could also be that the VPN provider throttles (no net neutrality issue).  Overwhelmed modems can behave in mysterious ways.

 

If this were my problem, I'd look at the characteristics of the RTMP flow and mimic it in some other protocol.  I'd need to generate it on something in the cloud with decent bandwidth.  I don't even know if Rogers has some fast path to Twitch.  Pure guess: the bad behaviour would happen to this mimic stream too.  That would imply that network neutrality was maintained.

 

I wonder if Buffer Bloat is striking somewhere, perhaps in the Rogers network, perhaps in the Modem.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bufferbloat

 

If you are using bridge mode, the problem might just be in your router.  For purposes of experimentation, consider connecting your gaming machine directly to the modem (make sure that your machine's firewall is appropriately cranked up).