03-26-2018 10:59 AM - last edited on 03-26-2018 11:32 AM by RogersCorey
Hi, I am using gigabit service with hitron coda-4582.
I would like to extend my WiFi signal for my house's basement
Any recommendation for WIfi extender (brand or model) to math with the modem?
07-09-2018 05:45 PM - edited 07-09-2018 06:56 PM
@traghipp here's the reference page for the amp:
You can download the spec sheet from that page. That amp is MoCA 1.0 qualified, so, as it is, you should be able to run Whole Home plus one MoCA channel in the D-High band. Only thing to keep in mind is that port to port frequency range maxes out at 1525 Mhz for MoCA 1.0, instead of 1675 Mhz for MoCA 2.0. So, you won't get the max MoCA performance out of it, but you might see whether or not its feasible as it is. In theory, it can only get better from there.
I'd give that a go first to see what sort of results you get. The one question with the amp is whether or not the original signal levels are ok without the amp. That amp has a VOIP port marked on it, which will be a straight thru connection without any amplification. There will be a 3 dB drop from input to output on that port. Typically I believe that the techs will install the internet cable on that port first, and use one of the other ports for the Home Phone, which I also run.
Can you have a look at that amp and determine if your modem cable is connected to that port? If so, can you log into the modem, navigate to the STATUS ... DOCSIS WAN tab and copy the lower signal level table in its entirety. Paste that into a post so we can figure out what your original signal levels look like. The copy and paste process will paste in the text contents of the table.
My concern at this point is whether or not your original signal levels are high enough to support a splitter instead. Looking at the modem data, if its connected to that VOIP port will allow us to figure that out. There are cases where techs have installed amps to make up for low signal levels, just want to see if this is one of those cases.
Edit: Just did a quick check. The amp has in integrated MoCA Point of Entry filter and its MoCA 1.0 qualified. The extenders are MoCA 2.0. So, in theory, you should be good to go. It should work, but not to the maximum data rates that you would see with a MoCA 2.0 amplifier.
Looking around, here's one example of a MoCA 2.0 qualified amplifer:
Looks like these have a VOIP port as well, which would be used for internet or VOIP.
There are probably other MoCA 2.0 qualified amplifiers around, just a matter of a little google-foo....
So, depending on your original signal levels, you would need a MoCA 2.0 qualified splitter or amp.
Edit 2: Ok, after a little google-foo. Here's an issue that I didn't expect and that is the possibility that the internet modem, connected to the VOIP port of your amp will be cutoff from MoCA communications due to the fact that the VOIP port is fed off of a two way internal splitter. Depending on how that splitter is designed, it might cutoff MoCA comms with the other ports, or, it might allow it. Just depends on the internal design. A quick test would determine what the situation is.
It would help at this point to know what port the internet modem is connected to and what port the Home Phone modem is connected to.
Have a look at the bottom post of the following thread, which mirrors what you're trying to do:
JWBoulder reports that he has a MoCA 2.0 network running, but, the spec sheet on the amp that he's using, the PCT-VCF-19P, only runs from 1125 to 1525, or, the MoCA 1.0 ranges. Here's the link to the spec sheet:
That's basically the same situation as your current amp, the difference being that the PCT amp is designed to allow MOCA comms with the passive VOIP port, where the internet modem would typically be connected to. That connection to the passive VOIP port avoids any distortion that might occur in the amplification stages, which could cause packet loss for internet modems. That is a known problem with the older Antronix amps which amplifies everything. The techs usually replace those when they come across any that are still in service.
07-09-2018 06:36 PM - edited 07-09-2018 06:36 PM
I just found this one on amazon which is the one you just found. If I buy this one I would still need the moca filter, correct? And, if I purchase this one I am pretty much guaranteed that I will get optimal performance (theoretically speaking of course)?
Here’s the link:
07-09-2018 06:54 PM - edited 07-09-2018 07:05 PM
Have a look at my "Edit 2" comments above. The PPC amp looks like it addresses the same problem with the MoCA comms with the passive VOIP port. From the spec sheet, it has a built in MoCA Point of Entry filter as well.
Edit: Only the PPC amp that you found would run two bonded channels in that D-High range, which will give you the highest performance attainable.
If you're in Toronto, you might be able to find a shop that sells those, such as a satellite tv or radio hobby shop.
Edit 2: The PPC amp that you found on Amazon is a better choice as it supports the full MoCA 2.0 frequency range. That would be my first choice.
07-09-2018 07:07 PM
07-09-2018 07:12 PM - edited 07-09-2018 07:30 PM
Hmm, ok, which means that the internet modem is connected to one of the amplified ports. That might no be ideal, but, it just depends on what is more important, the Home Phone or internet modem. I don't know if there is a priority with this equipment, that is, when both are present that the Home Phone takeS priority over the internet modem when it comes to connecting to the VOIP port of the amp. Food for thought. You could experiment by swapping the cables around to see if the Home Phone has any issues on an amped port.
This is where the services of a tech come into play, to determine the best cable network topology to reduce signal losses to a minimum and ensure that all equipment runs within their signal boundaries.
Edit: check your message inbox.
07-24-2018 07:14 AM
I can confirm the MoCA2.0 works! I turned on the MoCA setting on the Coda 4582 and installed 4 of the Hitron HT-EMN2 extenders throughout the home. I'm getting close to gigabit speed with wired connections at every location. Wifi connections are similar throughout the home and there are no dead spots.
To achieve this, I installed a PPC-9M-U/U-PI 9-port MoCA Home Amplifier that has a built-in POE filter and VOIP input. I used a splitter to connect the home phone and Coda 4582 to the VOIP input.
I believe you can achieve the same results by using the MoCA 2.0 extenders by Actiontec that are more readily available online. I lucked out and found the Hitron ones on Ebay.
I want to thank @Datalink for all of his advice. Without it I wouldn't know where to start!
09-12-2018 06:15 AM
I was thinking about using one of these WiFi extenders for a device with a weak wifi antenna but then I rembered reading in here somewhere that WPS was not a good choice.
So, as a casual internet user, I'm here to find out what the potential issues are with WPS.
09-13-2018 08:01 AM
Our excellent Resident Expert @Datalink has wrote a detail answer to your question in another thread: Re: Hitron Modem Wi-Fi Compromised.
Follow this link and mosey on over to that thread! If you still have further questions, don't hesitate to ask!
03-30-2019 01:32 PM - last edited on 03-30-2019 01:45 PM by RogersYasmine
CODA-4582U WPS Button
Hello i'm adding a wireless extender with Ethernet. the device has a WPS button on it so i can press to pair it.
just wanted to make sure this is also the WPS in the settings of the modem and if there is anything else i should know.
(potentially harmful link removed)
thanks for replies
03-30-2019 10:47 PM
@unidenjunky , yes, that should work. Just to note, WPS is no longer secure and should not be left enabled in a modem or router. If you've already paired the device, log into the router and disable the WPS for both 2.4 and 5 Ghz networks. The paired device should keep working (?). If not, log into the remote device and enter / reenter the network name and passphrase. I'd be surprised if you had to enter the network name, but, one can't assume that the firmware design is completely logical.
10-07-2019 10:42 PM
10-07-2019 11:14 PM - edited 10-08-2019 12:53 AM
"Does anyone know if it's possible to use MoCA while the modem is in bridge mode?". Yes, and no. Yes you can use your own MoCA equipment (minimum 2 adapters), and no, you can't use the modem's MoCA output when the modem is in Bridge mode as that output is shut down and can't be accessed thru the user interface.
There is a good reason why you don't want to use the modem's MoCA output anyway. From previous discussions, Rogers has been locking modems into the D-High band only, reserving the D-low band for the Nextbox Home PVR MoCA system. You will get better performance from a pair of MoCA 2.0 adapters where you can use the entire D band.
The MoCA frequency bands can be seen on page 9 of the following MoCA 2.0 / 2.5 Specification:
There are a couple of choices in terms of MoCA adapters:
There is a newer adapter out now that supports MoCA 2.5, running up to 2.5 Gb/s.
note that you will also need a MoCA 2.0 qualified splitter to replace your current splitter and a MoCA Point of Entry Filter connected to your incoming cable to prevent MoCA data from leaking from your network out to the external Rogers network, and leaking in from the Rogers network.
Here's a couple of links to MoCA threads that might be worth reading thru
10-08-2019 12:07 AM - edited 10-08-2019 12:08 AM
10-08-2019 12:15 AM - edited 10-08-2019 12:50 AM
@TechnicallyReal that Cat-5 cable might be the telephone cable that runs from the Bell box, down to the structured wiring cabinet where your telephone cabling for the house will terminate. Unless your house is very old, you should have a 66 block where all of the telephone cabling is connected to. The left side should have connected to the internal end of that Cat-5 cable, which ran downstairs from the Bell box, but now that its cut you probably have three pieces, one piece connected to the left side of that block, the long center piece, and another cut piece that runs into the Bell box. The right side of the 66 block should be connected to the house telephone cabling. Here's an image of the top of a 66 block, left side - external cable, right side - house telephone cables.
Which comes from the following page:
Edit: If you have one of those 66 blocks, check for the other cut end of that cable, still connected to the 66 block and possibly connected to a Rogers Home Modem if you happen to have one. Its likely that a Rogers tech might have cut that cable, which is unfortunate if you ever decide to return to Bell and actually have to use that cable.
Fwiw, depending on the path of that cable you might be able to use it to pull other cables thru, point to point. Just keep in mind, that you might want to actually leave a cable run in place, from the Bell box location to the 66 block. If you can, in effect use that cable as a pull string, consider running Cat-6 cable for your purposes, and leave a Cat-5 in place running to the Bell box (for future consideration. unlikely, but, hey, you never know).
10-08-2019 09:48 AM
04-08-2020 07:47 PM
09-06-2021 02:00 PM - last edited on 09-06-2021 02:14 PM by RogersYasmine
Hi. We have a Hiltron CODA-4582U modem set upstairs, and I am trying to set up a Netgear EAX20 wifi mesh extender on the main floor to improve the wifi signal on the front porch.
I have the EAX20 set up and connected to the Hiltron via wifi, and I can connect to the extender with my ipad, but the extender is not connecting to the internet. (I have given the extender network a different name so I can see what I am connected to)
The extender shows up in the Hiltron connected devices page. The thing I find confusing there is that in the column for "interface" it shows MoCA, where everything else (computers, phones, etc) shows either wifi 2.4G or wifi 5G.
When I connect my ipad to the extender, the Hiltron connected devices page shows another, separate entry for the extender that shows the interface as either wifi 2.4G or wifi 5G (depending on which one I connect to).
I've spent 2+ hours on a chat with Netgear support, which mainly amounted to me proving to them that I had set up the extender, that it connected to my router, and that my ipad was connecting to the extender. At that point I gave up.
I keep thinking that there is something in the router that is preventing the extender from accessing the internet. Is there something in the router settings that I need to look at and change? I would appreciate any advice. Thanks!
TL:DR - my wifi extender connects to my Hiltron router, but it doesn't get connected to the internet.
09-06-2021 11:03 PM - edited 09-06-2021 11:06 PM
@globe can you check the extenders IP address as it shows up in the 4582's connected devices list. Is the IP address beyond the IP address of the 4582's DHCP range by any chance? If it is, I can see that as a potential problem.
If that is the case, see if you can set up a DHCP Reservation using the Manually Add Client method. The DHCP Reservation is located in BASIC .... LAN SETUP. There should be two DHCP reservation methods available if they've both been carried into firmware version 7.x The first uses the current IP address. The second is a manual entry. I'd use the second method and specify an IP address within the IP address range of the 4852 which should be something like 192.168.0.10 to 192.168.0.200 Use an IP address that isn't currently occupied. When that is setup, reboot the modem .... ADMIN ... DEVICE RESET ... Reboot, and reboot the extender.
Normally I wouldn't expect any problems even if the extenders IP address is above the 4582's DHCP range, but, with version 7.x, anything's possible as its built on an updated kernel. So, maybe you found a bug??
Just out of curiosity, what's the status of the 4582's MOCA system, as seen at BASIC .... MoCA? It should be disabled.
09-07-2021 04:50 PM
@DatalinkThank you for your reply!
The IP address of the extender in the 4582's connected devices list looked like it was within range. I set a DHCP reservation with an IP address for the extender following your instructions, but that didn't seem to have any effect. I rebooted the router, and after it came up I also rebooted the extender, but no luck there.
However, I did find something in the extender's user manual about how to set a static IP address in the extender. The default setting in the extender is to dynamically get an IP address from the router. So, I changed that to static IP and set an IP address that is within the range of the 4582 (192.168.0.10 to 192.168.0.200, as you posted). When I rebooted the extender, it came back up with the IP address I set. And that IP address is now showing in the 4582's connected devices list. And now, devices connected to the extender connect to the internet.
The factory default IP address in the extender when first setting it up was 192.168.1.250, and it looks to me as if it was not changing from that for some reason?
also, yes, the setting for MoCA is disabled.
Thank you so much for your help.