UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

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Customer01
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 73

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016


@Gerim wrote:

For those of you , like me, who have lost all On Demand access due to a navigatr software issue, I heard back from "The Office of the President" who advised that although they had hoped for a fix by February they now have NO eta on the software fix. Apologies etc etc. working hard etc etc. 


 

Do you mean, they said no eta on a fix for the whole program, or just for the On Demand issue?

DrMike
I'm a Trusted Contributor
Posts: 257

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016


@Gdkitty wrote:

I have made a how to guide on how to get around the guide (since it can be quite confusing), if that helps at all.

http://communityforums.rogers.com/t5/forums/forumtopicpage/board-id/PVR_settop_boxes_remotes/thread-...

 


 I am impressed and you are (as usual) to be commended. THANK YOU.

 

Now, if only Rogers was as good to us as our volunteer friends.....

Gerim
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 17

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

That was in reference to the On Demand issue only.  That is currently my biggest issue, although I agree with all of the other issues and I know others have the same problem. I have also mentioned the phantom recordings and the "fluttering " I get on every playback but no specific response on those.

bert123
I've Been Here Awhile
Posts: 3

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Navigatr is a disaster - a big step backward. All the rogers PVR interfaces could have benefited with more testing with real users, especially for PVR related functions as opposed to viewing functions.

 

Before getting to recording, right off the bat, the basic viewing Guide to skim through channels and programs is 75% blank space when the text could have been bigger and/or could have included some information about each program.  But blank space is a waste.

 

As for recording, I have two computing science degrees and a long career in software engineering as well as communications and network systems design and it took a while to deduce the intentions of the interface, and at best, it is mis-guided.  It is badly thought out and what there is of it has glaring deficiencies and/or bugs.

 

The user inter interface for Navigatr wastes a lot of space on pictures which could have been used to present large font info on each item removing the need to always having to dive into a displayed item to get even the most superficial info (e.g. a recorded program's TV channel, or its day of week, or its time of day). Even though many modern screens can be huge, people watch them from further away so text size and font shape still matter.

 

The pictures are cosmetic and reduce available space for information and larger fonts for what minimal text remains. Also, some thumbnail pictures used as promos for movies barely show the movie name.

 

Recording is the most sensitive function as opposed to real-timeviewing. If you screw up, you miss a future recording or delete a program you have not yet watched. One complication that Rogers has no control over is the occasional mismatch between the broadcaster's intentions as reflected by the Guide's scheduled info vs the broadcaster's real-time scheduling issues, e.g. try recording CBS's 60 minutes when it is preceded by one or more football games - you never know when it will show.

 

One often sets up multiple scheduled recordings for the same program on different channels to improve the odds of getting the intended program. I do this all the time for normal programs. But for syndicated shows that pop up sporadically on many different channels at various times and days (e.g. poker shows), it has become much harder to manage those recordings. It used to be possible though not easy to get the channel number for a given recording or scheduled recording. That is now gone.

 

For recorded programs or scheduled recordings for which an episode is known to the Guide, you can get the logical channel designation e.g. HDCBS as opposed to 13. This is not easy to identify the specific channel number if you subscribe multiple CBS channels. When you consider the many sports network channels, it is not easy to map the designations to channel numbers e.g. which channel number is HDSPN3? One selects TV channels by number not by logical designation - that is how the entire TV interface is organised - sequentially with groupings relating sets of channels.  Specialty networks regularly change their names for marketing reasons which means the channel designations change.  The only advantage of channel designations rather than numbers is if a network moves from one number to another - that happens very rarely.

 

The situation is even worse for a scheduled recording for which there are no recorded programs remaining and no upcoming episode known to the Guide. Now you can only see the recording series generic info: you cannot see the channel number or logical designation and you cannot tell which day it was set to record - all you can see is "record this day only" vs "all days" but you cannot tell which day "this day" refers to.

 

Another flaw when there are no scheduled recordings for a series - you cannot delete a remaining "program" - i.e. the intent to record.  There is likely a bug here - I have been able to delete some but not others.  The dialogue item to delete future recording sometimes shows and sometimes not.

 

The combination of recorded episodes and scheduled recordings (i.e. the settings for future recordings) on the same screen will screw up people no end. It is neither intuitive nor safe. I am sure people trying to delete an episode will occasionally delete a scheduled recording or an entire series of episodes. Expect a lot of complaints and support calls. I would bet that the combination of recorded episodes and scheduled recordings was the bright idea of some Cisco geek who thought it would be elegant and sensible to combine past and future views together - maybe so, but practically, it is needlessly confusing to non-geeks and likely quite a few geeks.

 

People inherently distinguish a recorded program from a request to record future programs. 

 

The user interface in general is less consistent than it might be. Reverting to a previous state sometimes requires Exit, sometimes the red C(ancel) button, sometimes left arrow, sometimes up arrow, sometimes a context specific key. One implication of that is never knowing whether using Exit or C(ancel) will back you up a level or all the way back to real-time TV. Plus, the interface now uses the red C(ancel) button to access features in the odd dialogue.

 

The quick guide was always there using the arrow keys even on my old non-HD set-top box. Navigatr simply makes the info bigger and more intrusive. The 3 second delay is too short if one is considering options or is distracted e.g. by a child or dog or taking a sip of coffee etc..

 

Finally, you have eliminated the option that used to exist to create a completely manual recording (it used to be under Settings I believe).

 

Thanks for trying and good luck getting Cisco to address some of these issues.

 

The old Rogers PVR interface was superior to the new Navigatr.  From Day One  using it, its functionality and interface was obvious.

 

Not clear if Rogers or Cisco designed Navigatr - whoever it was really screwed up.  

Customer01
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 73

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016


@Gerim wrote:

That was in reference to the On Demand issue only.  That is currently my biggest issue, although I agree with all of the other issues and I know others have the same problem. I have also mentioned the phantom recordings and the "fluttering " I get on every playback but no specific response on those.


 

Good that you actually got some information. It's the first time I have seen that somebody actually got a tangible response. Not great news, but at least you know.

I wrote to the Ombudsman, and was passed to the Office of the President, just today.  So I am waiting to see what that response is.  I just want to know what is being done, and what can be expected.

Datalink
Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 7,258

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

@bert123 take a look at my post (msg # 760) on this page:

 

http://communityforums.rogers.com/t5/forums/forumtopicpage/board-id/PVR_settop_boxes_remotes/page/76...

 

 

and at BS's post (msg # 821) on the following page:

 

http://communityforums.rogers.com/t5/forums/forumtopicpage/board-id/PVR_settop_boxes_remotes/page/83...

 

 

Hopefully that will shed some light on the current situation and how Rogers ended up where it is now with Navigatr.

 

Here are links to Stockhouse news regarding Espial, which is the other partner in this whole affair:

 

http://www.stockhouse.com/companies/bullboard/t.esp/espial-group-inc/7?postid=24258755

 

http://www.stockhouse.com/companies/bullboard/t.esp/espial-group-inc/8?postid=24240805

 

http://www.stockhouse.com/companies/bullboard/t.esp/espial-group-inc/10?postid=24236972

 

http://www.stockhouse.com/companies/bullboard/t.esp/espial-group-inc/10?postid=24236543

 

 

And from the Globe and Mail's top picks for 2015.  Have a look at page 28 - Appendix 2.  It contains some interesting numbers such as an upfront payment of $10 /  subscriber and and an ongoing revenue rate of $1.50 / subscriber per year.  Reading thru the various Stockhouse posts, it looks as if Rogers and Espial had signed a contract in 2013, so, this has been in development for at least two years.  And, in summer 2015, out comes the alpha version.  

 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-investor/article22576107.ece/BINARY/Top_Picks_2015_FINAL.pdf

 

And from 2013, probably when this all started, Espial's announcement of a contract:

 

http://www.cedmagazine.com/news/2013/10/espial-lands-rdk-related-deal-large-cable-operator

 

Last but not least, Cisco sells its set-top box division this year to Technicolor:

 

http://fortune.com/2015/07/23/cisco-sells-set-top-box-business-technicolor-600-million/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



teragram
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 50

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016


@bert123 wrote:

 

 

Not clear if Rogers or Cisco designed Navigatr - whoever it was really screwed up.  


The company that designed Navigatr is Espial. You can leave a review on their Facebook page telling them exactly what you think of this abomination.

 

https://www.facebook.com/EspialGroup/?fref=ts

teragram
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 50

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016


@Gdkitty wrote:

You cant 😞
(its been a thing that many people have been asking for back... weither thats possible or not.. time will tell)

 

I have made a how to guide on how to get around the guide (since it can be quite confusing), if that helps at all.

http://communityforums.rogers.com/t5/forums/forumtopicpage/board-id/PVR_settop_boxes_remotes/thread-...

 


Apparently, commenting is disabled on the page where your guide has been published @Gdkitty. So I just want to say that you are to be commended for how much work you put into producing your guide. It is obvious you have worked far harder in producing your guide than was ever put into Navigatr. When an unpaid volunteer puts Rogers to shame, there is something wrong in the state of Rogers! Rogers cannot even admit that there is anything wrong with Navigatr, let alone put in the kind of effort that you have done. Thank you!

Gdkitty
Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 14,324

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Thanks for the kind words

 

the mods have asked to keep it locked, just to keep it clean and free of things like complaints in it. To just have help into there. (Need to edit it as people can't add to it on their own)

 

if anyone does have anything that I missed, they would like added, etc, please feel free to reach out to me.  



lisajeffrey
I've Been Around
Posts: 1

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Are there any plans to improve the horrible filtering in the recorded / scheduled recordings menu?

Why the heck would I want the same show not recorded as a series all listed separately!!!😤
And everytime I delete something I get sent back to the top of my list - really - it's not like the old way was great but it's like anything that was decent they decided to get rid of. I have to click on each recording to see a description. I'm wasting so much time now.

I hope someone is working on fixing this.