UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

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I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 46

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

@JonBoy49 wrote:

Apparently Rogers pushed out another update maybe Wednesday night?


The _only_ good thing about Naviagtr on my NB3 was that (for the most part) when you pushed a button things happened pretty quickly. Not any more.


Last night to select a specific program to watch took me over 10 minutes to set it up. Push the bitton - nothing happens - OK the box missed it so push again. Now the highlight shows on tile 2 - press select. It selects Tile 3 becuase, apparently, under the covers it had seen both button pushes but taken so long to do so that it hadn't updated the screen. As I say it took close to 10 minutes of steadily slowing down button pushes before I eventually managed to get to watch what I wanted. Deleting the program after watching it? Now that was fun! I won't go into detail but let's just say it took a very long time - so long that at one point it switched back to live TV in between its own deletion activities!

Thank you Rogers - you have so "improved" my TV watching experience that I'm finding myself watching more and more Netflix to reduce my frustration levels.


To the moderators - the one message I would love you to relay to your management (over and above to fix this mess) is this: Is is too much to ask that a simple apology be sent to those of us who have been suffering this since July? You know who we are, you know you screwed up by sending out software that any professional developer would be ashamed to even label an Alpha version. Yet nothing. No email. No offer of even a partial refund for the lost functionality. Nothing. Zilch. Rien. Your silence speaks volumes for your utter contempt for your customer base. 


I see this on an almost weekly basis (as do others) and the cure appears to be rebooting the box from the Settings/Troubleshooting menu (at the first sign of symptoms).


Sort of reminds me of the Windows 95/98/ME era where you wouldn't dare going more than a week without rebooting.


Hey, maybe that's it ... the folks at Espial tried to put Windows 8 Tiles on top of Windows ME and Navigatr was born.



I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 2,154

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

@Gdkitty Yes, we have had runaway recordings on the nextbox 3 before the rollout, and a few after the rollout - so this may not be a Navigtr issue, it may be an issue in the Cisco and Vidoscape side of things - It appears that Videoscape provides the integration in the setbox using RTN, while the ANT, now Espial provides customization to the RTN layer.


So yes, not a new issue - so who knows where this "bug" exists and I think noone has been able to identify how to replicate it which makes almost impossible to debug. Yes, I know anything can eventually be debugged, but since the programmers can't look at the immediate state of memory storage, caches, and logged debug routines, since it is not predictable, it will be a tough one to find.


On a basic level, I don't know why they don't implement a log and build in the capacity to pull the log back to their end if we call in with an issue.  Even the simplest of routers can have an ongoing log, and our computers and other devices have logs that often can be turned off, but windows has crash logs - why not at least a crash log to record the current state of the box on a reboot.


But doesn't appear that logs don't appear to exist on this boxes - there are standards for crash logs for IPTV (can find these online), but I could not locate any information on log tracking for QAM based set top boxes.



Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 14,321

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Yeah.. you would think, at least the PVR box, should have some capability to log.. (even if its a turn on when just needed thing).
(I can understand why the non pvr boxes may not, since they do not have any internal storage)

I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 9

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Well the Navigatr saga continues. y email account is flooded with everyones updates and concerns. I am unable to manage searches and find anything in these forums anymore.  I have started using my Ipad and an Anyplace App to view and manage my PVR because of all the shortcomings with Navigatr function. My latest issue is with the information on scheduled recordings. After figuring out how to view my scheduled recodings

(Green button/C button/down/down/down/left/up/up//ok

Wow there they are I finally made it. Fingers are sore but we are there.

Deep breath, and I can see there are multiple programs with the same tile. Hit enter to find info and arghhhhh doesn't tell me what time/channel basic info that anyone who has a PVR is looking for. In frustration I decided to hit reply to all the 120 community forum messages and send them to Rogers and post a complaint on My Rogers again. I received a callback message on my first complaint but was unable to completly understand it because of accent issues. The jist of it stated that Rogers was indeed taking these issues very seriously and forum information was being sent to the powers that be. In the Interim I am using an Anyplace TV App on my Ipad to manage my PVR recorded and scheduled recorded shows. Keep up the pressure. Last year I migrated all my online contact info away from Rogers.com emailnfo to Gmail. I suggest we all do that and then your internet provider can be the one who provides the best function/price/performance as it should be.

I'm an Advisor
Posts: 766

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Hello @popaoz,

Yes, this bug is extermely annoying (and galling) considering the amount of money we have/are investing in the hardware and service ($599 to purchase, $24.95 per month for PVR).


As I stated elsewhere, I actually created a spreadsheet to track my recordings...and to help me delete and re-schedule the recordings of all my shows.  A good PVR interface should PREVENT you from creating something like that, not force you to it!


I am hopeful that Rogers is listening to all our comments, complaints and frustrations.  I also hope that this situation improves soon, if only for the collective sanity of everyone on here! 🙂

I'm a Trusted Contributor
Posts: 527

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Wow. 26 hours!  I had a runaway recording too.   4 hr 42 min before we noticed it.   


People need to check the windows, doors, lights, alarm system and now the Rogers PVR before going to bed. 🙂


My wife's advice was:  "pull the plug on the thing if it is still recording after 11 pm"  



I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 2,154

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Yes, on one occassion I had a recording that was almost 3 days in length.  The box had frozen, so when we rebooted, we noticed that while we were away the storage had increased from around 30% to 89%.  Then had to go digging tiles to find the recording - actually did get to watch the original show, no future ones recorded, then deleted it. It took a while to fully delete, and then we rebooted again, just for good measure - building a whole set of superstitious behaviours - like a golfer and their waggles, or basefall players at the plate and the pitcher and catcher who do the most kicking, rubbing hands, bats, step up, step back, etc, where different socks, because intermittently something works and so they keep doing it, and continually adding to it, except in golf where you will get nailed with delay of play if you take too long.


Now my wife and go looking for recordings in progress if we see the red recording light on, and get paranoid when we don't see red dots, and when we see a set recording, or know there should be a recording and there is no light on. Go to Anyplace Tv for good measure, and if you get real paranoid of what is going on, let it run for say an hour or two incase there is something you really did plan to record, then shut it down, reboot, go back in and look for the recording, and either save it knowing that it is long - kind of like dealing with any shows after the super bowl this Sunday, or the NBA and NHL all star games, or American caucas results, you just set it to record longer, like say 3 hours.


Ahh, I am turning into a superstitious paranoid maniac, all from a box. Not only can it not improve our viewing pleasure, it also can't keep our sanity.



I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 102

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Tried that and it did work - thanks.

Interesting comparison with Windows - although I'd have added early XP to the list. I have been a Mac user for over 7 years now - the constant reboot, blue screen of death and other idiocies drove me away from Microsoft's products. Rogers can draw their own conclusions from that.
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 40

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

BS...You are really concerning us now with the limitations that Rogers has to fix the bugs given the precarious and disappearing support from Cisco and other associated hardware and software companies
I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 2,154

Re: UPDATED NextBox Navigatr - December 2015/January 2016

Concerns me too, but I am hoping that they are well on the way, and willing to pay the costs to get through the mess of the realities of changing suppliers and technology on this one.  I have been there in my own personal experience.


Whatever happens, they are going to have to respond if they want to avoid a dramatic increase in their already falling revenues, costs, and falling customer numbers on cable and home phone.  Only bundling and very cheap phone price keeps that number from falling further, and increasing prices on those of us who stay keeps the revenue for the whole company at least flatlined and able to still pay dividends to shareholders.


So I believe that they will pull it together if they want to stay as a player in one of their first business - cable.  Each of us has our reasons why we hang on, but we also see that many on this board and other media forums, and social media that there are many just packing it in.


For now, I am hoping that as they pull the last of the information on the issues of useability as well as bugs that they dive in deep, pay the costs required and get it right, or at least as right as they can get it.  No software or hardware is ever perfect, in particular because we the consumers keep asking for and expecting more, which is driven to us via the competition and ads of who is the first, the best, who has the most features, etc, along with the feel good ads of how good our lives would be to be able to just take two clicks to delete the whole series and get out and help with the gardening.  In my case, my wife would be happy if I wasn't on this board at all, and the interesting thing, is the bundled services ad still shows the old interface the red and black one.  Watch the ad closely and you will notice that one.


In my case, my wife keeps banning me, and I ban myself too, because I deal with frustration by trying to understand, so I go digging, and sometimes I unfortunately get answers that make both me and you nervous.


I continue to hope and do believe that they have the information coming to one single location and that with the will there is a way to get us to a solution that satisfies most of us and we can all move on.  If not, once the contract runs out, I may be gone too.


I continue to dream.