4k nextbox

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57
Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 4,015

Re: 4k nextbox


wayner92 wrote:  Does your TV tell you what format that signal is?

I'm not sure many TVs give the frame rate. For example, the info on my TV when receiving 1080P states 1920 x 1080.  The same goes for the diagnostics in my 9865. I also checked my Denon AVR and it also only shows 1080P, not the frame rate incoming, but it does show that it supports 24, 30, 60 frame rate in the monitor out settings.

 

Edit - When viewing content on my YouTube app on my 4K TV, the "stats for nerds" does show the frame rate. Of course, that's only my equipment, so other equipment might show it differently...  Good Luck.



mfait
I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 194

Re: 4k nextbox


@wayner92 wrote:

@RogersShaun wrote:

Hi @wayner92,

 

That's actually a great question you've got there, and something I've never really thought about.

 

I don't think that information is readily available, as all of our information simply states that we broadcast in 4k.  I believe that my Samsung 4k tv at home will display resolution information when I press the INFO button on my Samsung remote.  Maybe your tv has a similar function? 

 


I don't yet have a 4K TV or box so I cannot tell myself.

 

4K is really more of a marketing term then a technical term.  I am pretty sure that Rogers is broadcasting in 2160p which is 2160x3840 and not in "True 4K" which is 4096x2160.  I believe that the Rogers boxes are outputting 2160p60 but I am not sure.



4K for TV's are 3840x2160 and is the standard 16:9 widescreen aspect ratio.

Even though in computer talk, 4K is 4096, and true 4K would be 4096x2304 to maintain 16:9 aspect ratio for TV's.

There is not such thing as 4096x2160.

 

 

 

wayner92
I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 366

Re: 4k nextbox


@mfait wrote:

@wayner92 wrote:

@RogersShaun wrote:

Hi @wayner92,

 

That's actually a great question you've got there, and something I've never really thought about.

 

I don't think that information is readily available, as all of our information simply states that we broadcast in 4k.  I believe that my Samsung 4k tv at home will display resolution information when I press the INFO button on my Samsung remote.  Maybe your tv has a similar function? 

 


I don't yet have a 4K TV or box so I cannot tell myself.

 

4K is really more of a marketing term then a technical term.  I am pretty sure that Rogers is broadcasting in 2160p which is 2160x3840 and not in "True 4K" which is 4096x2160.  I believe that the Rogers boxes are outputting 2160p60 but I am not sure.



 

There is not such thing as 4096x2160.

 


Are you sure about that?

"The term “4K” originally derives from the Digital Cinema Initiatives (DCI), a consortium of motion picture studios that standardized a spec for the production and digital projection of 4K content. In this case, 4K is 4,096 by 2,160, and is exactly four times the previous standard for digital editing and projection (2K, or 2,048 by 1,080)."

From:  https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/174221-no-tv-makers-4k-and-uhd-are-not-the-same-thing

 

I am not complaining that 2160p is not 4K - that is close enough.  I just want to know if these 2160p30 encoders being sold out of China will do a good job encoding 4K from Rogers boxes, allowing my SageTV based PVR system to live on in the future when 4K becomes the norm the way that HD is today.   Folks are using similar devices today to encode HDTV as an alternative to the Hauppauge HD-PVR /Colossus devices.  I have been using the Hauppauge HD-PVR for almost a decade to record 1080i/720p/480p content for Rogers devices for almost a decade.

57
Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 4,015

Re: 4k nextbox

1080P HDTVs are 1920 x 1080.  Therefore 4K TVs are 3840 x 2160, exactly 4X the number of pixels.



wayner92
I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 366

Re: 4k nextbox


@57 wrote:

1080P HDTVs are 1920 x 1080.  Therefore 4K TVs are 3840 x 2160, exactly 4X the number of pixels.


Practically that is the case but technically "4K" TVs are not 4K, they are UHD and display up to 2160p as was explained in that article.

Again, from that Extremetech article:

"4K is a professional production and cinema standard, while UHD is a consumer display and broadcast standard"

 

But 4K sounds a lot more impressive than 2160p or UHD so the marketing folks ran with that.  And no one would really be able to tell the visual difference anyhow.

mfait
I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 194

Re: 4k nextbox


@wayner92 wrote:

@mfait wrote:

@wayner92 wrote:

@RogersShaun wrote:

Hi @wayner92,

 

That's actually a great question you've got there, and something I've never really thought about.

 

I don't think that information is readily available, as all of our information simply states that we broadcast in 4k.  I believe that my Samsung 4k tv at home will display resolution information when I press the INFO button on my Samsung remote.  Maybe your tv has a similar function? 

 


I don't yet have a 4K TV or box so I cannot tell myself.

 

4K is really more of a marketing term then a technical term.  I am pretty sure that Rogers is broadcasting in 2160p which is 2160x3840 and not in "True 4K" which is 4096x2160.  I believe that the Rogers boxes are outputting 2160p60 but I am not sure.



 

There is not such thing as 4096x2160.

 


Are you sure about that?

"The term “4K” originally derives from the Digital Cinema Initiatives (DCI), a consortium of motion picture studios that standardized a spec for the production and digital projection of 4K content. In this case, 4K is 4,096 by 2,160, and is exactly four times the previous standard for digital editing and projection (2K, or 2,048 by 1,080)."

From:  https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/174221-no-tv-makers-4k-and-uhd-are-not-the-same-thing

 

I am not complaining that 2160p is not 4K - that is close enough.  I just want to know if these 2160p30 encoders being sold out of China will do a good job encoding 4K from Rogers boxes, allowing my SageTV based PVR system to live on in the future when 4K becomes the norm the way that HD is today.   Folks are using similar devices today to encode HDTV as an alternative to the Hauppauge HD-PVR /Colossus devices.  I have been using the Hauppauge HD-PVR for almost a decade to record 1080i/720p/480p content for Rogers devices for almost a decade.


OK, I stand corrected.  Did not know about the DCI specs.  They should all be using the same standard.

 

Anyway, TV's are 3840x2160 and the marketing guys have decided to also call this 4K, along with calling it UHD, even though 4K represents 4096.

 

This is something that we just have to live with.

wayner92
I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 366

Re: 4k nextbox

Agreed - it is not that big a deal.  Especially since a lot of folks can't tell the difference between HD and UHD - the difference between 2160p and 4K is trivial.

 

And to come back to my interest - I just want to figure out if capturing the output of a 4K Rogers box at 2160p30 looks good for content like sports.  I don't want to have to give up my SageTV PC based whole-house PVR system as it is way superior to what is offered by Rogers or any other cable/sat distributor.  So I am looking for a path forward into a 4K centric world.

khungus
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 14

Re: 4k nextbox

In my opinion, sports look excellent. Sadly, that's all Rogers offers in 4k.  Even sadder, CBC Hockey Night in Canada doesn't broadcast in 4K.  Should you want to watch a Jays or Raptors or Leafs or Oilers game in 4K when its broadcast on TSN or Sportsnet, you are in luck (but ONLY if they are playing at home, where they have 4K cameras). If you want to watch other sports/teams in 4K, or those teams when they are broadcast on another channel, there's no option.  Even the upcoming Superbowl is not available to us.

 

I've had a 4K box for a year, a 4K TV for a year, the lack of content is really depressing.

 

That being said, I can instantly tell when I'm watching a game in 4K vs HD.

wayner92
I'm a Reliable Contributor
Posts: 366

Re: 4k nextbox

I live in Toronto so for the most part I only care about the Leafs, Raptors and Jays games being in HD, plus the playoffs along with other major events - especially golf majors.  So I think I am in pretty good shape there.

Hopefully the CBC will be moving to 4K - ideally they will start broadcasting in ATSC 3.0 in the near future which should look much better than the 720p that they use today for HNIC.

 

But I don't think they have yet made any announcements regarding ATSC 3.0

khungus
I Plan to Stick Around
Posts: 14

Re: 4k nextbox

From my experience, no sporting events (playoffs, olympics, golf majors) seem to broadcast in actual 4K on the 4K sports channels... ie: they're upscaling their HD broadcast.

 

Again, part of my major disappointment - I would have hoped to be able to view playoffs in various leagues and other major events in 4K, regardless of whether they took place at the ACC or Rogers Center.  That doesn't seem to be the case.