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Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 5,828

Re: slow wifi

@Stromey there are two possible problems here, the cable feed from the local node, or, the shared nature of wifi. 

 

Do you notice slow data rates in the evening with wired devices?  If so, that could point to congestion at the local node or at the Cable Modem Termination System (CMTS).  You really need to find a way to determine if you would suffer from the same problem over a wired connection.  That might involve buying a 50 or 100 ft Cat 6 ethernet cable that you can string around the home for test purposes.  I keep one on hand for the odd occasion that I'm troubleshooting a problem.  Either that or move a tv for temporary test purposes so that you can connect to the network via ethernet.  Knowing that the wired feed is ok would point any troubleshooting in the right direction.  

 

For the wifi situation, there are only so many wifi channels and as more users receive/send data via wifi over those limited number of channels, every transmitter (modem or router) has to wait for an opportunity to transmit its data.  During the day, when most people in a residential neighbourhood are at work, those modems or routers are still up and running, but, with no traffic to transmit, they might only be transmitting their wifi beacons, so, very little traffic on any wifi channel within a given geographic area.  Later in the evening, with everyone home, gaming, streaming, etc, etc, the amount of traffic probably goes up exponentially, all of which is running over a limited number of channels.  That problem will only get worse as wifi use grows every month/year.   So, not good news.  

 

The fact that your tv is upstairs is also part of the problem as any wifi equipment on a higher floor has a larger Radio Frequency horizon and range, and as a result can see a good many more transmitters in operation, all of which cause that device to run fewer transmit opportunities.  Wifi is a first come, first serve system.  When a given channel goes silent, as in the transmitting device has completed its data transmission, that starts a pseudo random timer in all wifi adapters on that channel (within a given RF range).  The first device to transmit claims the channel for its use.  Every other device which recognizes that the channel is now occupied has to wait.  So, with more data running thru all of the various networks, that just slows every network down, possibly adding to any slow data issues that you might be experiencing at the local node or CMTS. 

 

Can you do anything about it?  First or second thing to do is to determine if you see the same problem with wired devices.  Next, you can optimize the settings for your wifi networks and determine whom you're competing with for usable wifi channels to select the best channel to use.  Beyond that its time to look at alternative methods of distributing data around your home, which includes using ethernet if its available or MoCA 2.0 adapters connected to the cable system that exists in your home.

 

First step, check out a wired tv.  I leave that to you to determine the easiest way to do it.  Use another tv, or move the existing tv, or run a long enough ethernet cable for test purposes. 

 

Next, the wifi settings.  You didn't indicate which network you were using, 2.4 or 5 Ghz.  Using a 5 Ghz network should normally be the first choice, but, that depends on what you find when you look at your wifi environment.  So .....

 

.....can you check/set the following 2.4 Ghz wifi parameters:

 

Wireless Mode: 802.11 n 
Channel Bandwidth: 20/40 Mhz, although, for test puposes you could set this to 20 Mhz. In a crowded wifi environment, I would set this for 20 Mhz.  It will default to 20 Mhz in a crowded environment.
Wireless channel: AUTO or, to an open channel if one existed, or to the channel that offers the least interference from neighboring routers and modems as seen with a wifi monitoring application listed below.
WPS Enabled: OFF
Security Mode: WPA-Personal
Auth Mode: WPA2-PSK
Encrypt Mode: AES only

 

Check/set the following 5 Ghz wifi parameters:

 

Wireless Mode: 802.11 a/n/ac mixed
Channel Bandwidth: 80 Mhz, although, for test puposes you could set this to 40 Mhz
Wireless channel: 149 to 165     Use this higher channel range as it runs higher transmit power levels.
WPS Enabled: OFF
Security Mode: WPA-Personal
Auth Mode: WPA2-PSK
Encrypt Mode: AES only

 

If you had to change any parameters, reboot your router after the changes have been saved. 

 

Next, look at your wifi environment and see who else you're competing with for usable channels.  Load one of the following wifi scanners onto a laptop and then do a walk about, around your home and upstairs to see what the channel situation looks like.  I'd recommend the following order for selection:

 

Lizard systems wifi scanner

inSSIDer lite    (I run a licenced version of this, but the lite version is probably fairly close)

Acrylic

 

These can be found at the following locations:

 

inSSIDer Lite:  Requires a freebie account set up to use it.  That is displayed when you go to download the application.

 

https://www.metageek.com/products/inssider/free/?utm_source=MetaGeek+Customers&utm_campaign=d4c1da8a...

 

Lizard Systems wifi scanner:

 

https://lizardsystems.com/wi-fi-scanner/

 

A freebie home user licence can be obtained by using the Get Licence link for the Wifi Scanner on the following page:

 

https://lizardsystems.com/purchase/

 

Acrylic wifi scanner which is also free:

 

https://www.acrylicwifi.com/en/

 

 

WifiInfoView.  Within the options section there are multiple data displays, one of which is the % utilization of the wifi channels.  I don't know if this is a calculated number or a number collected from those routers and modems that transmit that data.  In any event, you will see a difference between the day and night utilization of the displayed channels

 

http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/wifi_information_view.html

 

 

When you walk about your home with the wifi scanner running, keep in mind which channel you are using and have a look at the graphical display on the Lizard Systems or inSSIDer display.  That will show you just how many other network are running on your channel.  Stop in place for two to three minutes so that the application has enough time to adjust to the new location in your home.  You can sort the data in the text data display by selecting the column titles to sort the data up or down.  Sorting the channel column will allow you to determine how many networks are running on each channel.  Sometimes there are too many to determine from the graphical display, so, sorting the text data is the only way to determine that.  

 

Ok, so, thats a starting point.  It should keep you busy for a day or two.  

 

Do you happen to have ethernet cabling installed within the walls of your home?  If you don't know, take a wallplate off the wall that has a cable or telepone port and have a look behind the wallplate for other cabling that does not have any connectors installed.  Structured wiring, if installed usually consists of two RG-6 cables for satellite or cable tv, one Cat-5e cable for ethernet, and one Cat 3, possibly a Cat-5e for telephones.  Typically contractors will install one connector and tuck the rest of the cabling behind the wallplate, where it sits until its discovered by the homeowner and put to use.  So, thats another question to answer, whether or not that cable bundle is installed in your home.  If the house is built within the last 15 years or so, there's a good chance that its installed, just not completed to its full potential. 

 

If you don't have ethernet cabling available, its also possible to use the existing cable network in the home by using a pair, or more, of Actiontec ethernet to cable adapters, or use a cable to wifi adapter.  Here's a couple of Youtube videos on that subject.  They're a little simplistic as there is more to setting these up, but, they're a fair demonstration of the capability of MoCA 2.0 adapters:

 

Actiontec ECB6200K02 Bonded MOCA 2.0 Review - Extend a network with cable TV wires!

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhCaZqxVAJE

 

Actiontec MOCA 2.0 802.11ac Wireless Network Extender Review - WCB6200Q02

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKqKISkgU7M

 

Hope this helps.....



I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

Re: slow wifi

Thanks for the tips.

Just to clarify, I have my modem bridged with a dlink wifi router and I have a netgear booster upstairs. I run an Ethernet cable from the booster to the android box. I don't run Ethernet cables into my tv.

Downstairs everything is hardwired via Ethernet cables into the modem.

I run all of my wireless devices via 5g
I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

Re: slow wifi

And the slowdown is only at night
Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 5,828

Re: slow wifi

@Stromey, is the Netgear booster a Netgear Repeater?  Just want to make sure I understand.  Repeaters usually end up cutting the throughput rates due to their channel usage.  

 

The Android box is an Android TV?  

 

Is there any way to test that tv with a direct connection to the router, just to determine if this is a cable system issue, a wifi issue, or a combination of both?  

 

Do you see any slow data issues with the wired equipment at night?

 

 



I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

Re: slow wifi

Sorry it's a netgear extender.

The android box is the same thing as Apple TV, except it runs on the android platform.

The tv cannot be hooked up anyway but coax and cable tv has been cut.

Everything hardwired into the modem works perfectly
Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 5,828

Re: slow wifi

Ok, so the Android box is just a small tv receiver box, like the apple tv, with one ethernet port and an HDMI port to connect to the tv?  Do I have that correct?  I run satellite tv, which connects via HDMI, no apple tv or android box.  Just want to make sure I understand this.  So, assuming that the Android box is just a small box, can you move that downstairs for test purposes just to see if you run into the same issues?  Or do you happen to have another one of these already downstairs which connects via ethernet and runs as it should?  This gets back to whether this is a cable network or wifi issue.  



I've Been Here Awhile
Posts: 2

Re: slow wifi

Wifi really slow! Rx and Tx levels are off spec apparently.

 

My wifi is really slow at home. I have ignite gigbit internet. 

I'm getting anywhere from 4MB/s to 80Mb/s connection speed on 2.4ghz and 25MB/s to 125MB/s on 5ghz. (depending on where I am in the house).  

My download speeds are ridiculously slow.  Tested to download Marvel game from playstore (~150Mb file)...it was downloading at less than 200kbs.  I receive attachments on whatsapp, for example picture files ~5mb takes about 2-3mins to receive.  This has been tested on multiple devices. 

I've tried to bridge mode and get separate router, wifi extenders, called in rogers a few times and even had tech come in a few months ago - he just changed my cable to a "new" one and said to disconnect all splitters if need be and put modem in open area.  Yes there is some interference. My modem can only be placed in two spots based on where the connection is. Both places have some interference due to having an av receiver and speakers near by.  

However I do not suspect the interference to be that much to a point of complete loss of transmission (which I get in certain parts of the house).  I've even tried changing the wifi channels...still not much impact.  I've even tried the Mesh Wifi systems.....its maybe helped a bit, but overall still very slow speeds.  

Someone told me to check Rx and Tx levels: 

Downstream for all channels is between -10dbm (channel 11) and -5dbm (channel 2). SNR is ~38 for all channels

Upstream is: 50dbm and 48dbm

 

 

 

 

Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 440

Re: slow wifi

Hello @vm2you,

 

Welcome to the Rogers Community Forums!

 

I know first hand how frustrating it can be dealing with slow speed issues, especially when it has gotten this bad. Downloading at less than 200KB in 2018 is definitely not right! =(

 

If you are getting -10 on your downstream channels then the signal levels are too weak and could be the root cause of the issues you are facing. We'd like to run some additional diagnostic tests on our end to see if other users nearby are also affected or if its an isolated issue.

 

Please send us a Private Message to @CommunityHelps so we can pull up your info and get started. If you are not familiar with our Private Messaging system please Click Here.

 

We look forward to your Private Message!

 

RogersTony

 

I've Been Here Awhile
Posts: 2

Re: slow wifi

Need help with wifi

 

My 2 bedrooms upstairs are having trouble picking up the WiFi connection. I have a white modem that Rogers says is the most up to date model but still having trouble connecting. I am completely computer illiterate and lost lol.

I have the 150u package with the white modem (sorry don’t know the name) in a small house. My sons computer is literally 20 ft away but on the second level with one thin wall in between. No gadgets in the way to interfere. After research I’m learning these modems have terrible range.

I looked online and found a nether nighthawk 5000 and from reading sounds like a great deal at the price I found. Can I use the netgear modem in replacement of the rental? Or somehow link the 2 and put the net gear upstairs?
Sorry for the long read and appreciate any feedback

Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 5,828

Re: slow wifi

@Unclefavre, ok, first things first, is to check and change the wifi parameters if necessary.  To do that, with a pc or laptop directly connected to the modem via ethernet, log into the modem.  Start a web browser and type in the following address into the address bar, without any www or http: 

 

192.168.0.1

 

Then hit enter.  That should bring up the log in page for the modem.  The credentials for the login are:

Username:  cusadmin    (this cannot be changed)

Password:   your current wifi passphrase unless you had previously changed it.

 

After you have logged into the modem, navigate to the Wireless (up top) ..... Basic Settings tab.  There you will see the tabs for the 2.4 and 5 Ghz networks, the WPS and Guest network.  

 

Starting with the 2.4 Ghz tab, check and adjust the network parameters to the following list:

 

Wireless enabled:  On

Wireless Mode: 802.11 n   (note if you have any old devices you could set this for 802.11g/n or perhaps 802.11 b/g/n.  My recommendation for really old devices is, its time to move on and update those devices.  
Channel Bandwidth: 20/40 Mhz, although, for test purposes you could set this to 20 Mhz. In a crowded wifi environment, I would set this for 20 Mhz.  It will default to 20 Mhz in a crowded environment.
Wireless channel: AUTO or, to an open channel if one existed, or to the channel that offers the least interference from neighboring routers and modems as seen with a wifi monitoring application listed below.
WPS Enabled: OFF

 

Network Name (SSID):  This should be long and completely random.  Since you very rarely ever have to key this into any device, fill the space (32 characters) with random characters.  If this is randomized, it will prevent anyone from identifying you or your house.  Note that when you set up the modem, you might have made both 2.4 and 5 Ghz network names the same.  I highly recommend setting those to different network names so that you know which network any given device is operating on.  Laptops for example usually aren't smart enough to change back and forth between networks on their own, so with both network running the same name, you don't know which network the device is running on which makes troubleshooting more difficult than necessary. 

 

Enable:  On

Broadcast SSID: On   (This broadcasts the network name.  In theory with windows only devices and perhaps linux devices well, you can do without, but, Apple devices aren't happy unless they can see the network name in the modem/router broadcast.

WMM(QOS):  On   This is Windows Multi Media Quality of Service, which uses packet type tags to optimize services to those devices that run multi-media traffic.
Security Mode: WPA-Personal
Auth Mode: WPA2-PSK
Encrypt Mode: AES only

Password:  This should also be long and random.  The password length is either 63 or 64 characters depending on what type of characters you use.  The minimum length for a passphrase should be at least 25 characters.  My recommendation is to fill it with random characters.  This only becomes painful when you have to key that into a mobile device.  

 

Save the changes.

 

The reason for the long, random character sets is to prevent a hacker from using precomputed hash tables for the purposes of hacking wifi networks.  This doesn't mean that WPA2 is impervious to hacking.  Its not, but, brute force attacks take much longer to accomplish.  WPA3 Authentication was approved this year, but, its going to be a while before we see this on modems and routers.  

 

 

 

Check/set the following 5 Ghz wifi parameters:

 

Wireless enabled:  On

Wireless Mode: 802.11 a/n/ac mixed
Channel Bandwidth: 80 Mhz, although, for test purposes you could set this to 40 Mhz.  I'd set 80 Mhz first. 
Wireless channel: 149 to 165     Use this higher channel range as it runs higher transmit power levels.
WPS Enabled: OFF

 

Network Name (SSID):  Once again this should be long and completely random.  

Enable:  On

Broadcast SSID: On  

WMM(QOS):  On   
Security Mode: WPA-Personal
Auth Mode: WPA2-PSK
Encrypt Mode: AES only

Password:  Again, this should be long and random

 

Save the changes.

 

For now, as you've indicated that your not totally familiar with computer operations, I recommend turning off IPV6.  There are two computer network address schemes in effect today, IPV4 which has been around forever, and IPV6 which has been around for at least ten years, probably longer.  

 

Navigate to BASIC (top list) .... LAN Setup.  change the Router Mode from Dual (IPV4 and IPV6) to IPV4 only.  Save the changes.  That will take two to three minutes to take effect.  Even with that change over, I'd like you to run a modem reboot.  Navigate to Admin (top list) .... Device Reset.  Use the Reboot function to reboot the modem.  I would reboot any connected devices as well.   

 

What those changes will do is ensure that the modem is running the highest level of encryption available which also allows the wifi to run at faster data rates.  The potential movement of the 5 Ghz network to the upper channels will ensure that the modem is running at its highest power output level for 5 Ghz channels which gives the user the largest range and highest data rate for 5 Ghz channels.  

 

Note that I indicated at the very start to do these changes via ethernet connection to the modem.  When and if you change the wifi network names and / or passphrases, you would lose connection over wifi, and you would have to connect to the modem once again with those new wifi network names and passphrases.  As long as you're prepared for that, it can work, but, I suspect that a good number of users have problems recovering from the changes if their not ready for that to occur.  

 

Once those changes are made, have your son reconnect to the modem if you have changed the wifi network name or passphrase.  For the wifi networks, the 2.4 Ghz networks will give the longest range but with a slower data rate.  They also suffer from the most interference from your neighbours wifi modems and routers due to that long range.  5 Ghz networks have a shorter range, but with a much higher data rate.  As you walk around the house with a wifi scanner loaded on laptop, you can see the changes in received power levels from both networks.  

 

Fwiw, the Intel or Broadcom designs these modems, which are then built by various manufacturers.  The wifi component of the newer modems are actually surprisingly good, but, the ISPs disable a good number of features which would provide better performance for wifi networks.  This keeps the maintenance and support costs down, but, drives users to distraction when their wifi networks don't measure up to the expectations.  

 

Your modem is currently running in Gateway mode, operating as a modem and router.  It can be set to run as a modem only, allowing you to use any router that so choose.  That is a typical approach as it give the user far greater control over the various functions that result in better wired and wifi networks.  For a small house, I suspect that a single router would suffice, although I prefer to run a wired ethernet network for fixed devices as they run interference free, compared to wifi networks. 

 

So, yes, you can definitely use a third party router for your network. 

 

The Netgear Nighthawk 5000 that you indicated.... is this the router that you're referring to?

 

https://www.netgear.com/home/products/networking/wifi-routers/R8300.aspx

 

Fwiw, I run a Asus RT-AC86U that I'm satisfied with.  As I'm more familiar with Asus routers, I can be of greater help if you decide to go with an Asus router.  There should be users on the forum who can help with Netgear routers.  My only recommendations in this regard are to ensure that the router has external antenna, and that the processor is a minimum 1.4 Ghz processor.  There are 1.8 Ghz processor routers on the market now as well, the Asus RT-AC86U being one of them.  If you run gigabit rates, router horsepower is the name of the game, in order to run the data rates and any router functions that you might be interested in running.  

 

For ways to connect to upstairs, look behind any wallplate that has a cable or telephone port on it.  What you're looking for is the presence of more cables, such as Cat-5 ethernet or perhaps RG-6 cables for cable or satellite purposes.  The Cat-5 cabling would allow you to run an ethernet network in the home.  Any additional RG-6 coax cables would allow you to move the modem around the house to a better location for wifi purposes.  You can also run ethernet via the coax cables by using ethernet to coax adapters.  This can work very well with the right adapters and splitters or amplifiers, depending on what is required. 

 

Lastly, I'd like you to load inSSIDer Lite and possibly Lizard systems wifi scanners on a laptop if you have one that can be used for wifi scanning purposes, and also on your son's wifi connected pc.  

These can be found at the following locations:

 

inSSIDer Lite:  Requires a freebie account set up to use it.  That is displayed when you go to download the application.

 

https://www.metageek.com/products/inssider/free/?utm_source=MetaGeek+Customers&utm_campaign=d4c1da8a...

 

Lizard Systems wifi scanner:

 

https://lizardsystems.com/wi-fi-scanner/

 

A freebie home user licence can be obtained by using the Get Licence link for the Wifi Scanner on the following page:

 

https://lizardsystems.com/purchase/

 

When you walk about your home with the wifi scanner running on a laptop, keep in mind which channel you are using (149 to 161) and have a look at the graphical display on the inSSIDer or Lizard Systems display.  That will show you just how many other network are running on your channel.  Stop in place for two to three minutes so that the application has enough time to adjust to the new location in your home.  You can sort the data in the text data display by selecting the column titles to sort the data up or down.  Sorting the channel column will allow you to determine how many networks are running on each channel.  Sometimes there are too many to determine from the graphical display, so, sorting the text data is the only way to determine that.  

 

The question of the day is how many other networks are you competing with?  The wifi scanners will tell you that.  Note that for your son's pc upstairs, as he's located at a higher elevation, his pc will have a larger Radio Frequency horizon, so, the scanners on his pc will show more networks from around the neighbourhood.  

 

What you might find is that running in the higher 5 Ghz band, you have competition from your neighbours.  That competition will be countered by the higher power output from the modem.  At the higher 5 Ghz channels, its 1 watt.  For the lower 5 Ghz channles, its 50 or 200 milli-watts depending on when the device was approved by Industry Canada.  That power difference at the higher channels does make a positive difference, despite the competition from the neighbours.  So, even with that competition, you might find that you're better off running channels 149 to 161 instead of down around channel 36.  That would take a little experimentation to confirm it, but, if you have time someday, you can reset the wifi channel in the modem to run a test for different channels.  

 

Personally speaking, I've written off the 2.4 Ghz wifi channels in my neighbourhood.  With at least 35 or more modems and routers running nearby, the data rates in that band are pretty slow, so, I've moved everything possible up to the 5 Ghz band.  When you look at the inSSIDer Lite display, that is probably what you will find.  The left side 2.4 Ghz band is probably over crowded, and the right side 5 Ghz display might be ok.  You will have to determine that yourself.  You can ask your son to take a screen shot and save the image so that you can post it in another post.  Use Control + Alt + Delete (simultaneously) to capture the image, then paste that into something like Microsoft Paint which comes with Windows operating systems.  Save that image.  It will save with a .png extension.  Then you can post that image.  

 

Ok, hope this helps.  Please let me know if you have more questions.  At any time, if you're stuck with something, don't hesitate to post a question, or contact tech support to have the Customer Service Rep change any settings for you. 



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