severe bandwidth drop

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I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

severe bandwidth drop

Hello. I have a Hitron CGN3 and with 250 Mbps Rogers service I was getting consistently over 300Mbps. I put it in Bridge mode to use with my Asus -RT-N16 running Tomato.

My ping and upload rate have not changed however my download rate has fallen off drastically. It is now around 130Mbps tested many times on Speetnet.net.

I expect some drop but this unacceptable and I do not want to switch back.

Any ideas?

thanks all, Bj

 

 

 

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Retired Moderator
Retired Moderator
Posts: 624

Re: severe bandwidth drop

Hi @keef_ca

 

Welcome to the Community Forums!

 

You've come to the right place for your concern!

 

One of our Resident Experts @Gdkitty @Datalink can definitely assist here.

 

@RogersPrasana

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Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 6,599

Re: severe bandwidth drop

@keef_ca there are numerous comments across the net which indicate slow performance with Tomato firmware loaded on a router.  Unfortunately, when you go beyond 100 Mb/s for an internet service, depending on the router that you have, you will have to make a choice, run the router for its features, or run the router for speed without using many of its features. And, if you want both, you will need a faster router.  I don't know if that router has Broadcom's Cut Through forwarding which essentially is WAN to LAN port forwarding without any, or limited involvement from the CPU.  If it does, it will be called NAT Acceleration in the Asus Firmware.  My RT-AC68U has that located in LAN .... SWITCH CONTROL.  For anything over 100 Mb/s, that has to be enabled to run full WAN to LAN speeds.  I suspect that Tomato does not support that selection, so, you would suffer a throughput reduction because of that.  

 

The overall problem is that using the firmware features requires the data to route thru the processor for some type of firmware processing, so, you take a throughput hit on the internal routing, and due to the load that is placed on the CPU to carry out the required processing, and, you want that done at high speeds.  Under 100 Mb/s, usually not a problem.  For anything above 100 Mb/s, that routing and processing becomes a problem.  

 

You can confirm that the modem delivers the same throughput rate in Bridge mode by leaving a pc connected via ethernet when the modem has been switched over to Bridge mode.  You should see the same data rate whether the modem is in Gateway or Bridge mode.  Just remember, that with the modem in Bridge mode and a pc connected for test purposes, the pc is relying on its own firewall for protection.  The modem will act as a straight thru modem, and will not protect the pc from external probing.  I would run a speed test using the www.speedtest.net Toronto Telus or Beanfield server and then disconnect the pc.  Connect the router and pc via ethernet and you should then see the speed drop as you have described.  

 

So, that leaves you with a choice, return to stock firmware for the router, or buy another router that will provide the higher data rates with Tomato loaded.  I would look into the issue of Tomato supporting Broadcom's Cut Through Forwarding. If it doesn't, you would have to find a router that is built using a different chipset, but which is capable of higher data rates and capable of loading Tomato.  

 

Just as an aside, due to rule changes in Canada and the U.S., modem manufacturers have been forced to find ways of preventing end users from changing the power output levels of the various modems.  Companies are taking different approaches to this.  Asus for example has changed its boot load to only load recent firmware and prevent anyone from loading other firmware that doesn't comply with the current rules.  Merlin now has firmware out that is compliant, I don't know what the status is with Tomato.  So, if you have an older router with older firmware loaded, you can still load 3rd party firmware.  With a new router, that might not be possible depending on what you are trying to load.  So, some research is in order to determine how to proceed.

 

Hope this helps.



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I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

Re: severe bandwidth drop

I appreciate all the info you gave me. The real reason I use Tomato (or WRT) is that I am able to force Opendns Parental controls. My kids phone and tablet have Google DNS hard coded I'd like to get around that.

 

thanks, Bj

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I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

Re: severe bandwidth drop

I played with Port-Forwarding on the Hitron to trap outpund DNS calls and force them to the internal DNS (OpenDNS specified DNS) with little luck.

 

As I played with it it seems like there is somting there that may work. I just cannot figure it out.

 

thaks, Bj

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Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 6,599

Re: severe bandwidth drop

@keef_ca I came across a post in the DSLReports forum which indicates that Tomato supports NAT Acceleration.  It's disabled by default but can be found under Advanced -> Miscellaneous.  Have a look to see if it is there, and if so, reconnect to the modem with the modem in Bridge mode and see what turns up in a speedtest.  If the NAT Acceleration isn't there, I would presume that the model of router that you have doesn't have the particular Broadcom chipset with Cut Through Forwarding.  

 

Regarding the OpenDNS, I understand exactly what you're getting at.  So, you need to do a DNS Redirect from Google to OpenDNS.  I don't believe that will be possible with the Hitron modem.  The hardcoded address will override any thing that the modem has set for DNS addresses, so, you need a rule based approach to do this and the Hitron modem won't support that as far as I know.

 

What you could do, depending on how your network is set up, is run the modem in Gateway mode, and maybe use the 5 Ghz wifi network for the parents.  Then setup the router as an Access Point.  Normally you would turn off the firewall and DHCP on the router.  That would leave the modem's firewall to protect the network, where that Fireway or NAT can be very picky, and use the modem's DHCP to assign the network addresses.  With the router set up as an access point, try leaving the DHCP up, and set up the routers address range so that its beyond the modem's address range and doesn't cause any conflicts, essentially operating as its own sub-net.  There is a double NAT situation going on there which isn't desirable, but, I would try it out to see if there are any real issues in terms of speed or port forwarding.  If you had to do any port forwarding for an XBox or Playstation, this would cause issues.  If you didn't have to run any port forwarding, this might work.  Use maybe the 2.4 Ghz network for the Android devices.  If your house was wired with structured wiring, you could park the modem in one location and the router somewhere else.  That would allow you to use both the 2.4 and 5 Ghz networks for both modem and router.  

 

So, hopefully that will give you some food for thought.



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I'm Here A Lot
Posts: 5

Re: severe bandwidth drop

That is alot. Its way beyond me. It was so easy with Tomato and WRT. Click a box and add the OpenDNS info and thats it.

 

I may go and buy a really fast router that has Cut Through Forwarding. If I do not load 3rd party firmware I have to hope that the firmware is comes with suppprts DNS Redirect. 

 

If I load 3rd party firmware I doubt any support Cut Though Forwarding. 

 

I'll give my kid a library card and a pad and pen and give a  'in my day all we had was all we had' speech.

 

thansk alot.

Bj

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Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 6,599

Re: severe bandwidth drop

I would check out your router to see if it has the NAT Acceleration setting first.  If so, problem solved.  I don't believe that any router will have DNS redirect capability out of the box, you will have to load Tomato on it.  So, that brings up the question of what routers are supported by Tomato.  That will take a little research, and then you have to add in the complication of the recent rule changes in Canada and US which might prevent anyone from loading older versions of Tomato.  So, you will have to see what the current status of Tomato is regarding its install capability on newer routers.  If Tomato doesn't comply with the header requirements or other new rules imposed by the router manufacturer, you may not be able to load it thru a simple load method.  Look for any secondary methods of loading Tomato as well.