On December 15, 2015, I let everyone know that we had started to roll out the updated Navigatr guide. Take a look here for that post.
As we continue to roll out the update, customers will be notified ahead of time that they will be getting the new software.
If you have received the updated Navigatr software (i.e. since December 15, 2015) and would like to ask a question and/or share your findings/learnings, please do so in THIS THREAD.
Thanks very much for keeping the community a pleasant place to be!
If one listens to the interviews posted earlier of various interviews, or PR information by the president of Espial, they have done considerable development in Europe and Africa - I am not sure they have done extensive customer research in Canada, and I get the gut feeling that they feel they know what consumers want because they have had great success accross the big pond.
For some of these countries, this is the first and only experience they have had with a complex set top box, with IPTV and many other features, that have not even come to us yet.
Plus, they had the opportunity of working and implementing closely with RDK, and the hardware stacks and OS stacks (as they call them, and the Espial version on top, which there are quite a number of iterations - this one that goes on legacy boxes and requires close discussion and coordination with the cable provider, the setbox developer (Cisco), their next layer of software (Videoscape, now Technicolour), understanding what customers do not and how or if they can transfer current functionality to this complete differently designed model of RDK rather than RTN. Note that they say they have little control of RDK as it is a open source software and they define how it can be used in order to keep standardization of their middle ware on any box in the world. And Espial bought out ANT which was one of the other layers in the old system.
And it appears, that due to market changes, company changes, and other unpredictable factors, such as end of product support and distribution, it basically got dumped on us and I suspect the company decided to just take the risk of not losing too many people, get the feedback retroactively rather than proactively, and then work through the unknowns of how to make it all work as they go along. And some things, since Espial has licensed certain models of the use of the open source tools and API's, means they may be reluctant to change some things (like the Tile model), since this is kind of their trademark.
So we wait and see, but at least @Gdkitty with the input from a very large group of true testers, designers, and system analysts, has created a fabulous how to tricks and tips as the box currently sits as of 11/02/2016.
I guess there are few options for us, except,
Like Gdkitty myself and others, we try to understand it and pass on what we know to others so they don't have to suffer as much as we did (although we suffered, I think we all like a good challenge of problem solving, in particular those of us who are retired to prove that we still can do it, and can call Rogers on the marketing pitches that just don't hold up to testing and analysis).
So that is one options - keep providing feedback on what we find and how to work with it.
The next one is just as valid, complain and ask for the old one back, but it appears that is not going to happen, period.
Commiserate amongst each other, but be careful about going too off line, or off topic, and remember to keep it clean.
Express your emotions, they are valid, but respect the people who have to read it - keep it clearn.
Cut the cord totally and find alternatives, and then you have new options if these things happen again.
Or go to another company, either teir one, or teir two, knowing that there are pros and cons to leaving or staying.
Or also, you can escalate as far as you can take it to try to get your point to someone who has the power to influence things.
Remember to respectful and polite in your discussions as you move up - they are more likely to be sympathetic and listen, and maybe, just maybe, something surprising may happen - at least some form of compensation at the least.
For now, I just remain patient, keep communicating, although I apologize, I have been getting frustrated and angry and it has been showing in my writing. I ask my question, would I want people to talk to me that way, and lately the answer is no, but it is tough to edit unless you catch it quick, and it is not possible to delete it - although if you do get to edit and want to get rid of it totally - just type in sorry, didn't want this out there - moderators may leave it or remove it, or you can ask moderators to edit or remove something.
And the moderators catch me at times when I slip out of line (I am only human and have a servere disability too) and I always thank them via PM for keeping my posts clean.
I have said this a number of times in the last two weeks that I am going to stay away, but things like GDKitty's how to tips and tricks and I just had to comment, as well, as since I post often, and I must be contributing in a useful way for people, which is my number one goal in all my posts, I get kudos, or feedback, and I like to return the feedback to those people.
Good night, Bruce
@teragram And as @roxandtreez, who created the original list has said, it was done within a few days of the original release which was stopped around the same time, there are many others on the old version that were brought up, as well as new ones on the 4 versions that have followed (for people who are confused by that - there was a build around December 15, that came out, then was stopped shortly afterwards, then another build in January, that again was paused, then another build, and now a recent build and recompiling of all modules (so that is where we get four what I still call beta builds, as we continue to work on a test box, which many things to be resolved.
It took five months to do the first 8, a couple of weeks to handle the power off feature, not sure what the last one just did, but some issues were reported after it came out, so I am hoping since they have most of the information in their hands now, they can sit down, decide how to prioritize the bug fixes and decide on how to deal with usability functions, or decide that is how it will stay is a possibility, but I hope that it is taking time because they are designing and testing actively with hopefully customer feeedback along the way and that they take their time to get it as right as they can. I don't expect perfection or for everyone to be pleased - that is not usually possible, but at least take on some of the major stuff (if it is even possible on the new platforms, and if not, just let us know, then we can make our educated deicsions on what we are willing to live with, or do we move on) - this is the respect as a customer that I do seriously expect, and no matter how polite and friendly and supportive your reps may be in trying to help us, when you blow it big on the use of the product, none of that good customer support and service means nothing. If a customer feels that they got junk and they are not being listened to and communicated to openly, with transparency, and honesty and fully, customers become frustrated and respond as best as they can in order to move on and enjoy life and their viewing experience of their payed for content. In my mind it is not too much to ask for.
And another hope that it may be moving faster is that Espial has been posting for positions in Toronto and Ottawa (which means our stuff in general) for developers, designers, testers, engineers, and documentors - they will need a bit of a learning curve, but they are sure going to have to hit the ground running, and hopefully they take all the feedback and suggestions very seriously in order to move faster and get the product as close as possible to a product most of us can live with.
I can dream still. Cyncism and anger, and frustration is not good for me, and I am sure it is not necessarily pleasant for others to experience, when they just want to move forward.
Take care everyone, and for the new users - I hope it is soon that we will see dramatic change.
I couldn't agree more.
I sent an email to Rogers this evening telling them why I have been actively cancelling my services and sited having my perfectly on topic, and 'clean' responses either edited, or deleted completely from this list as one of the reasons, along with the deafening silence from anyone at Rogers. This is of course on top of the wonderful experience we've all enjoyed since Navigatr entered our lives.
And to think I have been foolish enough to actually pay Rogers for this level of mistreatment.
Thank you Rogers. It was a wonderful 25+ years while it lasted. I will keep the cars, the house and the cat as part of our divorce settlement.
Thank you Datalink for the historical summary of this fiasco. Took a look a systems far ahead of where Rogers is now including Red Rhino, which is where Rogers is trying to take the battle. RR is Canadian and owns its software. Have you looked at RR?
not sure if this is the right place but
I do not like the new format
the guide is too small and cannot get bigger lettering as per your consultants
it hangs when im trying to navigate through my pvr records
and since the new format my box now reboots 2-3 times a day
@rmacm: Sometimes, if the description is too long, the year of the movie or the *rating may be at the end and if the description is truncated, is not visible since it's "cut off". On some movies, the information is simply not there, so check a variety.
To see how long single recordings are, you need to start playing them and it'll show the time remaining on the progress bar, but not before you start to play the single recording. When the progress bar is up, you can also see the channel that the programme was recorded at the top left. The progress bar comes up when you hit play, FF, etc. If the progress bar stays up for too long, hit "exit" to get rid of it. This is not good coding, but it's the way it currently works and Rogers is aware of this "failing".
Here's a list of issues and tips:
Here's a very good "How To", generated by Gdkitty:
Please read these issues/tips/how to posts thoroughly as they will save you hours of frustration.
I noticed that with one of the latest updates, the rewind 8/10 sec button works differently in that you cannot press Exit too quickly as the progress bar now takes a second to appear after the rewind. I have a Harmony button programmed to do the Rew+Exit combo and it stopped working - bar stayed on.
I just got around to playing with it and now I have to have a 1 sec delay between Rew and Exit on an NB3 and a 2 sec delay on an NB2.
It seems that button presses used to be buffered during the rewind, but is not any more. The down side to this is that I used to be able press rew multiple times quickly to go back 30 secs or so, but now I have to wait 1 sec between button presses.
Sounds like a first world problem, but this used to work and now it does not. A stupid change.
Also, this whole thing is caused by the fact that the progress bar stays on too long. It should be gone in 2 seconds after all button presses that make it appear.
The Explorer 4642 HD and similar without the PVR has already got the new software upgrade . Navigate Guide is working on the display monitors , just be patient with Next box 3 and the PVR 's as for them there is a glitch and we are working on it to resolve it . cd00 xx will display without affecting the performance of the box , some channels will be under par .
You should back up your PVR on an external Hard Drive , rebooting or removing from power source or relocating without power will erase all recordings , a handy 2 tetra bytes external HD will do it . A solid state drive will work better with a blue tooth transponder . Ask Teck support if it is allowed on your system.
Single occurrence recordings show no date or time information at all
Oh yes you can FIND them in a clumsy sort of way:
THE DATE of the RECORDING:
1 CLICK the box (with the image - or if recorded a while ago without the image)
2 On the top right of the next page, there is "RECORDED"... Under this it states the title (redundant) and the date.
TIME INFORMATION: (For this you have to be FAST)
IMMEDIATELY when you click start, on the bottom right side of the <former> time-line you will see a NEGATIVE number. The number remains for milliseconds only.
I assume it is the "absolute value" of the negative number since as the video progresses, the number (which is in HOURS.minutes) decreases.
At the end of the recording (CERTAINLY NOT NECESSARILY the end of the movie) it is 0.00
Here's an easy way to remember the number:
NAVIGATR could be renamed to:
And renamed back to NAVIGATR if they ever got around to reading these PROBLEM lists and became motivated by something (obviously not us) to fix ANYTHING on this problem-ridden, time-wasting, inadequate, tormenting, NON-intuitive, <...> disaster.
SORRY – I am just trying to be nice
P.S. this is just as on-topic as <happily> announcing yet another ROLLOVER in a thread bursting with our desperate comments and many many peoples' AMAZING efforts at clearly detailing &delineating issues yet receiving no ROGERS acknowledgement. (Only "ANOTHER ROLLOVER for yet another part of Ontario" as if we aren’t here...)