Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

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I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 3,674

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

@bslipiec wrote:

Hey Guys to follow up on the original post. 


I had the rogers tech come out to take a look at the speed issues, and after about 3 minutes the appointment was over. He threw his hands up in the air and said " thats digital". Not overly impressed with the explantation. The Appointment was over before it started.  No solution in sight. 


But to rule a one thing out.  It isnt an IR remote issue, the remote works fine for the tv. 


Overall the cable service need a huge upgrade to remain competative over the next couple years. 

Why does Rogers make it so hard to enjoy thier service? 

-unable to fastforward thru commerical on "On Demand"

-no comercial skip forward button (30 Second ahead buttons are pretty standard). 


The longer I am a Rogers customer, the more I question why. Smiley Mad


Yes, clearly it's an issue that can't be solved on site by a Rogers tech. The problem is with the box, the firmware and Rogers interface.


As for the lack or limitations on Fast Forward, the only reason I can see for it on RoD is so you can't skip commercials if at some future date Rogers wants to put them in. At this time all I see are small Rogers promotional breaks.


I still have an old Magnavox DVDR I used before I had a PVR. It has a 30 second commercial skip button. You just press it any number of times you want to build the length of skip you need. I got pretty good with it anticipating the length of skip for different programming and channels.  I suppose the new PVRs don't have it because it's too easy for the customer.

Rogers PayGo. Location: S-W Ontario
I've Been Here Awhile
Posts: 3

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

Poor Quality PVR Hardware/Cutting the Cord decision 


For over 10 years I had been fighting with Rogers due to numerous issues with my TV and internet . Every year there was a minimum of 2 service calls where they had to replace my cables boxes\pvr's or mess with the wring due to signal issues.


I finally had enough last year and snail mailed the president who had someone actually look at the support logs for my account, and they immediately see something was seriously screwed up.


They sent a senior tech who opened the box out side my house and immediately said my wiring was wrong. For years other techs had come in and just done bodge jobs but no one had every seen the actual root cause until this guy.


This senior tech now spent several hours re-wiring my entire house and fixing all the mistakes the numerous other techs had made.


I figure great, finally, after all these years, it is resolved.  I even get a years free service credited to me from the President's office for all the years of frustration. I was happy.


But today I just had to swap the 3rd PVR box that died since that fix, losing everything that was recorded on them again. What was even worse was when the tech tried to install a new box, the first one was DOA.


I also noticed the base build for the firmware was 2013 . Don't they update their base build? How poor is the quality of the hardware when that many crap out in a year? 


I purchased an OTA antenna last month to test out to see if I want to cut the cord.


If Rogers can't provide hardware that works, it makes the decision very easy. 

Resident Expert
Resident Expert
Posts: 6,986

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

To check out what you can see via OTA broadcast, go the the following link and type in your location details to see the reception map.




Check mark "Show lines pointing to each transmitter" just below the right side of the map in order to see the directions to the tv transmitters.  The distance to the transmitters will dictate the type of antenna that you might need, ranging from one that will be useful for local broadcasts, to antennas for deep fringe or, extended range reception. A deep fringe antenna will be very directional, aimed at a distant transmitter and may not be much use for local broadcasts.  It just depends on what channels you might be interested in and where they are located in relation to your home and in relation to each other.  Here's one example of an extended range antenna, at a site where antenna kits and other accessories may be ordered online;




TThe OTA forum located at digitalhome.ca is a good place to start any research into OTA reception.




I'm a Trusted Contributor
Posts: 202

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

@bslipiec said "I really believe it is this bad on purpose."


I tend to agree with you, bslipiec.


I've been with Rogers for over 25 years, and I've had the NB3, and before that the NB2, and before that the MUCH more reliable SA8300 PVR (that had a BUNCH more useful features that were DISCONTINUED with the introduction of the Nextbox.


So Rogers has gone from the Scientific Atlanta PVR that was reliable and solid, and it had approximately 15 useful features that were not included in the Nextbox, and now Rogers has introduced the Navigatr interface to the NB2 and NB3 - and this is a STUNNINGLY poorly designed GUI - designed obviously by someone who has never used a PVR in real life.  This new interface takes AWAY many abilities (to easily see your future scheduled recordings in a simple list organized in order from most recent onwards):  this being the most significant reduction - but there are MANY things MUCH more difficult to do with the new guide:


and after all these years watching Rogers PVR's - I've come to the conclusion that ROGERS DOES NOT WANT TO GIVE US A RELIABLE FEATURE RICH PVR.  I suspect that someone in senior management has made the calculation that they will make MORE money if we don't have the control we like over when we watch what WE want to watch (with the inherrent ability to skip through commercials) - and by sticking us with the WORST DESIGNED PVR of any cable company in North America, Rogers is subtly pushing us away from recorded TV, and back towards watching Live TV - where they make MORE money because we are FORCED to watch commercials.


Why would they make MORE money this way?  Because Rogers is no longer just the 'pipe' that pushes TV programming to us.  They now produce a lot of their OWN content, and they own MANY TV channels (that make money when customers WATCH advertisements), and Rogers owns at least one huge sports team - and their revenue is based significantly on advertising dollars.


And even if this wasn't the case - even if Rogers was only making money by pushing TV programming to us - they could easily have backroom deals where they tell the program producers that THEIR customers watch more commercials than other companies cable customers because Rogers customers are less able to skip through commercials.  So Rogers may be able to cut more 'sweatheart' deals when the licence content.


And even if this conspiracy theory is NOT true - Rogers has INTENTIONAL CHOSEN not to invest the money to hire competent programers to give is reliably working, well designed PVRs.


Rogers knows that, as an oligopoly - we really are NOT free to drop them and choose another company that will treat us well.  Many of us have NO other choice, and for those of us who can go to Bell - well Bell will treat us just as badly - because they CAN - because there is no TRUE choice available to us.


.... end of rant ....


PS: oh - and speaking of hiring COMPETENT programmers - Rogers has CHOSEN not to invest in compent programs to give us reliability in multiple ways - like being able to log into this website to write a reply.  I wasn't able to do so for 24 hours because all I got trying to log in was the bouncing little balls at the point of login - and nothing happened after that.  And Rogers website to see your bill has had lots of problems, and Rogers VOD has been broken for weeks, and Shomi hasn't been working for a while, and for about SIX MONTHS we didn't have access to, I think they call it Anyplace TV, or whatever their name is where you can view your PVR over the internet or on your phone to update your programs, etc.  Then, when they reintroduced this feature - it wasn't working much of the time.  It has been a complete random chance that the product you want to use MIGHT work today.




They've learned that we've developed 'learned helplessness' with their products.  We can't get out of the cage and we're being driven insane by products that might work today - or might not - and we just run around on a maze and give up complaining and keep giving them our money because we're tired of calling them to complain that their service isn't working properly.  And we can't leave them (the maze.)


Anybody ever wonder if a few people ACTUALLY HAVE been driven NUTS by the constant unreliability of MANY of Rogers services?

I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 2,154

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

@billmcintyre Agree totally.


And has it driven me a bit nuts at times.  Back in August, I had my account turned off because it had taken over my life and I couldn't get my mind off of it all. I was doing what is called perseverating, which is a very dangerous symptom of anxiety and stress.


So for my mental health, I just shut myself out, took a break, came back to find nothing had really changed, in fact reading through the last 50 or so most recent posts and almost all of them are problem related with no answers. Was actually recommended by my therapist because I was becoming angry, frustrated, sarcastic, all things I don't like to be.


I have two tickets open at the moment, and have had two closed, - stating it was resolved, when it wasn't.


I haven't done it yet, but I a formulating a complaint summarizing everything that I have reported that are still not working, the number of billing issues that occurred in the last year that led to many an hour of conversation and frustration, generally gettting some compensation, but in most cases, was revenue neutral with no acknowledgement of the challenges to get it fixed, except for the frequent, we are sorry for the inconvience.  I got that again today, and told the person not to use that phrase when I describe in detail an issue and how it is not resolved. This is beyond inconvience, it is completely unsuable services or usable through absolutely non-intuitive and complicated workarounds with no fixes coming in most cases.


So thanks for your rant - it is well earned.  Since you were ranting, thought I would too.


I am running out of ways to approach this, and am currently helpless feeling like a rat in a maze, with electric shock pads randomly being turned on, with the reward just of reach most of the time.


Eventually, you are right, learned helpless kicks in and you give up, because you just can't figure out where to go anymore.


I don't wish to go to Bell, had my own bad experiences, don't like satelite, the alternatives over existing cable infrastructure is too slow and not reliable yet, so I keep waiting and my past time these days is finding all the bugs as they come, theoretically debugging it and suggesting how to fix it, but as you say, I just can't see that they are dedicating any money or focus on making sure new stuff works reliably, or even keeping what they have running reliably and keeping up with technology changes.


So I will continue writing here, providing support to others who are suffering along with me, try to find workarounds, but emphasize, don't make these permanent, fix the underlying issues - that is why they are called work arounds - you are working around something that doesn't work until it gets fixed.


I will keep opening tickets, and next I go up the food chain.  Haven't done the CCTC yet, but that is certainly next.  Not sure I will bother with ombudsman.


To conclude - poorly thought out support response of the day - told the tech person if you zoom any browser to a point where the width exceeds the resolution and frame of the browser, a well designed user interface will turn on the horizontal scroll bar, which they did do back in August.  Her answer, we don't recommend you use above 100 zoom.  

The screeen views don't render properly if you don't use 100% of lower.


I thanked her and said, that is not a reasonable expectation - persons with visual acuity issues will zoom to larger views in order to read better and scroll as needed, and the recommendation violates the principles and recommendations of standard web design for accessability issues of vision, and recommended by OADA. Not fully enforced by law yet until 2025, but all companies were to start developing plans and assessing their accessability by earlier this year with plans to be fully implemented by 2025.


Same as when they say do the cache, cookies, browser thing, I say, yes I could do that, but those are all workarounds, I want a ticket opened because a workaround is not a solution, it is just a temporary way to get around the issue until fixed.


Rant done, good night,






I'm a Trusted Contributor
Posts: 202

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

@BS  Bruce:  One thing that enraged me about having an open ticket for my 3 month problem of my PVR not being able to play any recordings for much of the time (detailed in another thread - a known problem) - is that it was obvious that Rogers was doing NOTHING to resolve the issue, and they had no fix, but they WOKE ME UP ALMOST EVERY SATURDAY MORNING with their infernal automated recording saying they were 'working on the problem.'  BULLONY!  Their incredibly infuriating interrupting calls made me more angry than I can describe.  (But because this insult occurred during the weekend - I felt that I should wait until business hours during the week to call and reach someone 'useful' to hear my frustration.  Probably not necessarily logical - and part of the learned helplessness thing ----- but then by Monday I would 'forget' and not bother calling - which made me EVEN MORE angry when I was woken up AGAIN the next Saturday.  (And part of me - in my conspiratorial paranoia - was thinking that Rogers was giving all of those of us who bother them with phone calls the royal finger by almost knowingly bugging us at 9 am on Saturday.  It felt like they were trolling by intentionally calling when they knew we would be sleeping in early Saturday morning.  Makes you wonder - if some manager who is forced to respond to 'complaints' - has chosen to respond in a manner that he thinks might allow him to act out his resentment for being 'bothered' by setting up an automated call at a time that would bother a lot of people.)  )


What made me even more angry is the knowledge that the calls are all a public relations campaign, and just an appeasement to make it SEEM like Rogers cares.  And it's similar to Rogers advertising this great new interface - Navigatr - and bragging about how it 'makes our user experience better' - when the opposite is the case. 


I, too, have had one 'lovely' experience with Bell:  I got their home phone, and despite the fact that I VERY CLEARLY told the criminal employee on the line that I DIDN'T want their long distance service - and I told him FOUR TIMES - I discovered 5 months later that they had added one of their Long distance packages to my phone service - but worst of all - they have this fraudulent charge of $7 or $8 a month for some garbage they ADD to your bill because you have their long distance plan.  So you pay a long distance fee and some other charge for some reason - and this is NOT explained - and it is all a scam - and I describe it being added to my account despite my clear objections as criminal fraud.


But stupid me - I didn't examine my bill closely for 5 months - and then Bell offered to take the fee off for only one month.  I told them, politely - to get stuffed - and I refused to pay the fraudulent charge - so they cut off my phone service.   I still am tempted to go to whatever the name of the dispute agency is that abides over this sort of dispute because the loss of my (business) phone number may have cost me $5,000 to $10,000 in business since then.


That's why I rant about Rogers AND Bell being the choice of walking down one alley and getting robbed by a thief with a gun, or walking down the other alley and getting robbed by a thief with a knife.


But the choice of living with Rogers cable or something else is about to begin for me a step in that direction as I sign up for Neflix soon.  I just bought a 4K TV - and I can't wait to check out Netflix's 4K native content.  And for those who are considering buying a 4K TV - let me tell you that existing 1080p content LOOK GLORIOUS as it is upscaled by your 4K TV.  It's awesome.  Breathtaking.


And the only reason I haven't signed up for Neflix yet is my PVR hard drive is almost full - and it is set to keep recording the shows I watch every week - so I need to empty the drive out a bit before I can ignore my PVR as I'm bingeing on Netflix.


And next I'm going to drop $400 on a video card for my computer so I can see full 4K on my TV from my computer.  I'm looking forward to seeing some of the many photos I take at that resolution.


As an aside - I had the funniest (pathetic) conversation with a tech help guy about my Samsung TV tonight.  I was worried that the manual for my 4K TV recommends a 1080p resolution when hooking up the TV to a computer, so I wanted to be sure I wasn't wasting $400 on a new video card - so I TRIED AND TRIED to explain to the dumbest phone tech guy I've EVER talked to in my 54 year old life that I was hooking my computer up to a TV.  I WISH - oh boy, do I wish I had a recording of that call.   You would be STUNNED at the inability of this guy to comprehend what I said over and over again.  He said that 1080p was all that was useful because a computer screen was too small to see 4K.  So I repeated for about the fourth time that my connecting my computer to a SEVENTY FIVE INCH 4K TV - and this guy still asked me again and again what size my computer screen was.  He just DIDN'T GET IT - and I got tired of trying to explain it to him.


I only wish you could hear the call.  I was so irritated I said thank you and hung up and called back and got a reasonably helpful other person - but asked him to speak to a supervisor to 'comment' on the dunceicity of the first moron.   But I still haven't heard back from a supervisor - and I'm going to be royally peeved if they wake me at 9 am (when I like to sleep until 1 pm).  But now - as I think of it - I want to ask a supervisor to provide me with a copy of that call.  I think the internet would LOVE to hear it.  (But I think maybe part of the issue this guy was dealing with is English may not have been his first language - and maybe he's never even HEARD of someone connecting their computer to a TV to use their TV as a computer display.  Still - I'm PEEVED.)

I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 2,154

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

Yes, some would call it paranoid, but parnoia is not a mental health issue, if the things we are paranoid of are generally true.


Hang in there friend. I had a similiar issue with a GPS company a few years back.  They did an upgrade to the product, which then led to the battery going dead and would not recharge within days.

Sent three back at UPS canada costs (my costs) because they said they couldn't get an agreement for RMA shipping from Canada, when you get the replacement received from Mississauga.


Many hours spent on it.  The last time it failed, I told them to send me one and I would return the other, if the new one didn't fail.  They did agree.  Well, it failed, and I ended up with two of them.  Now anytime you plug it in it says it is fully charged, but as soon as you unplug it, it dies, and you do a hard reboot to start it.


Some of those calls were absolutely insane.  They have a forum like this onew where agents will pick up the steps and get it solved, but everything he and I wrote was going live on the forum, so boy they were beginning to look real dumb.


And of course, no one else was dealing with the same issue, I must have not charged it properly, try this step, tryt another step, *I would do the steps before contacting them, and enjoy a cold drink while I said, sure I will do the steps, guide me through it, then I would sit back and watch something on the internet, and come back and say, didn't work, they would give next step, here we go again, then finally, they agreed to RMA it - oh yeh, 36.00 shipping charges to return - no charges from US, but as they said, Canada UPS wouldn't set up a deal with the american company and shipper and had cancelled their service outright - yeh right, I believe that - I have done RMA's to the U.S. many times, and the reality was we shipped to Misssauga, then they shipped to U.S


Sound familiar, you can't believe anything they say, they just read from a troubleshooting script, and don't even clue into the fact that they are dealing with the same issue over and over again, and killing their business and driving their customers nuts.


The company is still around, but they have changed their product line around and got rid of the troublesome ones.


Incompentency abounds for sure.  Enjoy your 4K and netflix.  We have Netflix too, and have contimplated many times just dumping cable, as Ilive in GTA, almost every network is available over the air. My wife and I were looking at it over the weekend.  And alternative streaming services options and devices are certainlyh available.


So do enjoy your change over when the time comes. And watch out for the "boogie men from Rogers" jumping out to come and get you. Smiley Tongue




I'm an Advisor
Posts: 1,524

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

This is a very interesting thread. I haven't been able to see MyRogers account for almost a month now. Despite having a case number, which has been escalated at least once, nothing has happened. As far as I'm concerned, Rogers staff show absolutely no sense of urgency when customers have problems. There's all the usual platitudes, but no action. I've been a Rogers customer since the late 1970's and am seriously considering scrapping my cable and wireless services. In the absence of cable, I've been a Nextflix customer for a few years and its content keeps getting better and better, all for $7.99 a month. I find myself watching it a lot more than anything on cable. I pay a lot for my wireless service and rarely use the phone, so I'm considering alternatives there as well. There's a lot of services out there to replace Rogers for less money. I would keep my internet service with Rogers, as it's quite reliable and I've invested money in their hardware. I have a plan with a 550GB limit, so I doubt I would need to change it. However, their Ignite packages, with unlimited downloads, would be an alternative and are reasonably priced. I don't have a 4K TV yet, but am considering getting one. My computer video card supports all 4K resolutions and can even fake higher 4K resolutions on my 1080P monitor. I also have a Denon AVR, which can up convert everything to 4K.


I think streaming services are the way to go, whether it's a Netflix-type service or music services, like Spotify, which I also subscribe to. Also, by setting up a VPN on my router, I can easily sign up for services that are not available in Canada if I want to. The future is here and, as Justin Trudeau said, it's 2015! Smiley Very Happy

I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 2,154

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

@billmcintyre I have my tickets advise me by email now.  It is unfortunate that the addition to myrogers, a while back of listing the open tickets is now gone.  I wonder if the phone system still asks you if you are calling about your open ticket.


Yes, I had them driving me nuts twice a week to tell me the status of the ticket, then they said it was resolved, which it wasn't.  Didn't bother to point it out.  Saved it for my next issue, I just brought the old one up again.  And I don't accept what people have been told that they can't open a ticket because it is a known issue.  I make a complaint if they refuse.  This is my issue, and I don't care whether it is known, I want it documented that I have an issue with a ticket. It is a way to at least have an illusion that we can hold them accountable, but if you have to escalate, you can use this history of tickets to make one's case.



I'm a Senior Advisor
Posts: 3,674

Re: Poor firmware, poor execution, Or Why Cordcutting is better.

@BS wrote:

I have my tickets advise me by email now.  It is unfortunate that the addition to myrogers, a while back of listing the open tickets is now gone.  I wonder if the phone system still asks you if you are calling about your open ticket.

I had an open ticket for over 6 months after I called in about a cable problem on a certain channel. The problem went away, but I kept receiving an "important message" by email every couple of weeks. I didn't want to sit on the phone for half an hour to get it cancelled, so I finally did it through CommunityHelps.

Rogers PayGo. Location: S-W Ontario