cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

New Nextbox Navigator

BS
I'm a Senior Advisor

My wife was just moving through the new navigator and has the following questions, concerns.

 

The first screens for the guide are fine, but the fonts are a bit small, even on a 46 inch TV. We are all getting old, let's not forget us.

 

In the section for listing and managing recordings, the boxes cut off the full names of the shows, don't show dates, would rather have option of old list style with all details right in one spot.

 

When looking at multiple shows, you have to go to each listed show recorded, but there is no reference to the date until you highlight the show. Then this highlighted information on the show is even smaller and I have almost perfect vision after my cataract surgury, and I can barely read it. My wife can't read it at all. You do have the date on the top right that is in a bigger font, but the show information is almost unreadable and my 24 year old daughter who just came in also comment that it is almost unreadable.

 

Is there an option for increasing font size and changing to a list view rather than the boxes on the list of the recordings page. Don't like the box feature or the way the contents view at all for the above reasons. See little or benefit for this change.

 

Otherwise, I am kind of indifferent to the new layout, but do like some features.  I will probably turn off the banner across the bottom off in settings. I can get the same information from the guide.

 

Yes, there is a bit of getting used to change, but some of this change seems to be change for the sake of change. I do like that it takes less clicking to move around though, it just the display formats and font sizes that are creating legitimate problems for my family.

 

BS

 

***Edited Labels***

1,698 REPLIES 1,698

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

OLDYELLR
I'm a Senior Advisor

@Hcoates, I would believe that Rogers can't restore the recordings erased by Navigatr, but I refuse to believe that they can't revert back to what was before Navigatr. The only reason not to would be some contractural deal with the software developers that would be too costly to reverse (like the Ontario Liberal government cancelling their wind turbine contracts) or just saving face.


Rogers PayGo. Location: S-W Ontario

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

Hcoates
I Plan to Stick Around
Maybe when they don't see my monthly contribution they will see the light.

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

neilpalmer400
I'm a Trusted Contributor

@OLDYELLR wrote:

@Hcoates, I would believe that Rogers can't restore the recordings erased by Navigatr, but I refuse to believe that they can't revert back to what was before Navigatr. The only reason not to would be some contractural deal with the software developers that would be too costly to reverse (like the Ontario Liberal government cancelling their wind turbine contracts) or just saving face.


Rogers doesn't need to save face, they'll just come up with another new one, like Navigatr.

 

 

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

park
I'm an Advisor

@OLDYELLR wrote:

@Hcoates, I would believe that Rogers can't restore the recordings erased by Navigatr, but I refuse to believe that they can't revert back to what was before Navigatr. The only reason not to would be some contractural deal with the software developers that would be too costly to reverse (like the Ontario Liberal government cancelling their wind turbine contracts) or just saving face.


 

This new Navigatr thing is at most a few weeks work. 
Redoing the mixed up and incomplete state diagrams is the hardest part.  So, either:

1. Rogers grossly overpaid, or

2. Rogers slapped this thing together to get out from ongoing payments for the old one, or

3. Rogers got snookered by their software supplier, or

4. All of the above.

 

 

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

billmcintyre
I'm a Trusted Contributor
Hi Hcoates. I've noticed quite a few people already saying they're leaving Rogers because of Navigatr (and other issues that have bothered them for a long time that have not been addressed) - and Rogers may be noticing the egress of customers - but they obviously don't care enough to cancel the roll-out of Navigatr - so Hcoates - I think you need to start talking with your friends and neighbors and get on your social media and express your anger about this issue.

One person who had her 8642 ERASED last week said she talked to her neighbors - and ALL TWENTY OF HER NEIGHBORS had their PVR's erased as well.

Maybe Rogers will act if she talks to all her neighbors about FORCING Rogers to do something about this abortion they call an "upgrade."

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

BS
I'm a Senior Advisor

There is a new pinned post putting all tutorials in one place. That is great - notice that it doesn't show the difficulty of finding your recorded or scheduled recordings, or any way to see scheduled cards without playing concentration solitare.

 

Hopefully fixes will come soon to clean up these issues. For now I wait.

 

I spoke with Office of President today and suggested that before rolling out an upgrade like this again that there are many people on this forum topic who have a very indepth knowlege of testing and documenting issues. I suggested they set us up with an pre upgrade box with screen and a new box with screen (why these items loaned to us - so our families aren't interupted from life while us retired, highly skilled people test the boxes to death, do side by side comparisons, ease of use comparisons etc.  Our backgrounds mean we know how to do this well and most of us our very strong documentors, and can even generally identify were in the psudeo programming models based upon use, we could probably identify exactly where in the coding modules where to bugs may lie and by referencing back and forth, we can identify clearly where the difficulties lie for a skilled user, and we will provide documentation on how to do it both ways. Then you can take it out to naive, non program oriented users and see how well they can pick up, what level of support and the learning curve, and listen closely to their feedback.

 

She was in agreement that this was a very good idea and she and other staff have been thinking the same. So they are listening, and I hope they seriously consider the offer. I have personally talked to at least three people who have expresed an interest and have time. This makes the user part of the development, testing, and redesign team, making things more efficiently done. This is the models that are out there. Not new, but also not commonly done. 

 

As a last note and I will be generally staying away from the board. I not sure there is anymore constructive criticism and recommendation that can be presented and that almost all that is left is complaints, which I think are good to be heard, but as I learned today, getting to the office of the president, getting a knowledgeable support person to understand where we are coming from and so forth proved to be very beneficial for me to summarize all the issues from my perspective. She had read the forums too which is good. 

 

One piece of constructive criticism to close off: 

http://www.connectedrogers.ca/news/now-you-can-store-more-on-your-nextbox-pvr/

 

In this post from 2014, it talks about how great it is to be able to save almost 200 shows with the compressed video file system.  Great, but not if you can't ensure stability of the box. If it fails you lose everything, or the upgrade kills it, you lose everything. If you want to use this as a great thing of the box, you have to ensure as best as you can that nothing will be lost due to actions of your own programming implementations.  It also contradicts and even comments on the topic of hoarding and encourages us to do so.

 

All the best to everyone and hears to hoping this gets cleared up soon.

 

Thanks for the hard work by all of us and hopefully the rogers team can get it right in the next pass. Even windows 10 has just release 10.1 1 month after they rolled out 10 officially, so we can always expect things to go wrong in a big fix.

 

Bruce

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

timreuel
I've Been Here Awhile

2 weeks later  still no change

i got off luckier as i have a netbox 3

 

same old rogers

 

if it aint broke don't fix it 

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

shan-man
I Plan to Stick Around

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread reaching out to Ron Perrotta, Senior Vice President Marketing, Residential Services. I just called the main Rogers number and asked for him. Was transferred to the voicemail of his assistant Nikki. Left my name, phone number, said that I saw his name was associated with the Navigatr marketing materials, and then gave a brief explanation of my concerns - in particular that Navigatr is a complete disaster and that we want the old guide back. Will update this forum if/when I get a response.

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

Datalink
Resident Expert
Resident Expert

@BS great post.  The same situation applies to the new Hitron internet modems, which have been problematic to say the least.  And.....there are also people who are also willing to help out and test firmware updates.  They just need to be asked........



Re: New Nextbox Navigator

theClubHopper
I'm a Reliable Contributor

@shan-man wrote:

Someone mentioned earlier in this thread reaching out to Ron Perrotta, Senior Vice President Marketing, Residential Services. I just called the main Rogers number and asked for him. Was transferred to the voicemail of his assistant Nikki. Left my name, phone number, said that I saw his name was associated with the Navigatr marketing materials, and then gave a brief explanation of my concerns - in particular that Navigatr is a complete disaster and that we want the old guide back. Will update this forum if/when I get a response.


 

I called too. I'm well aware Ron Perrotta is in marketing, but the fact of the matter is that HE contacted us (via the letter which bore his name) and as no other names are forthcoming from Rogers, I have a couple of questions for HIM, that I know he will be able to answer. So when a receptionist intercepted and asked "The reason for your call?", I said "Ron contacted me".

 

She said "Is that about Navigatr?" and I said "Yes". I know I could have lied, but why should I have to stoop to such tactics? She then transferred me to the Office of the President instead. Having already spoken to them last week and not been provided with the answers I was looking for then (which was by then a full week after I first pleaded for answers and got none), I was understandably even more displeased than before.

 

The person at the O of the P claimed that Mr. Perrotta is unable to take or respond to customer comments, and that if I had a problem with that the next step would be TO GO THROUGH THE OFFICE OF THE OMBUDSMAN.

 

UN-believable! All I want to do is contact someone at Rogers who contacted me and I have to go through an ombudsperson?

 

I told her: "If Mr. Perrotta does not personally call me back this afternoon, then I will have no choice but to take this to the next stage, and believe me, that will NOT be dealing with your ombudsperson". I left my name & # and .. time is ticking.

 

Incidentally, last night I tried to find the name of any person with authority within Roger's "Cable" aka "Television" division. Literally everyone I've identified via Google either:

  • no longer works for Rogers or has moved on to other areas of responsibilty at Rogers
  • was or is really in the Marketing Dept, just like Mr. Perrotta. 2 years ago, it was "Phil Hartling, senior vice-president, consumer segment, Rogers Communications" who was bragging in a Rogers press release how great Nextbox 3.0 was going to be [link]. Mr. Hartling's LinkedIn profile shows that he was and is presently "Senior VP, Consumer Marketing".

Perhaps I've inadvertently uncovered the reason for this whole mess: apparently, nobody is in charge.

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

shan-man
I Plan to Stick Around
Has anybody contacted the Rogers Ombudsman yet? Perhaps that is the next logical step in trying to resolve this fiasco.

Or maybe the next logical step is to just bide our time and let Rogers roll this junk out across all of their markets. If there's this much noise about it already, imagine when everyone else gets it...

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

JohhnyRockets
I'm a Trusted Contributor

It does appear that Rogers is not reversing its decision on Navigatr despite 33 pages of discussion on this thread as well as other related threads on these forums; despite numerous comments on various 3rd party forums such as The Digital Home Page; despite numerous complaints via the social media such as Facebook and Twitter. 

 

Yesterday, Rogers posted the following on FacebookLove TV? So do we. That’s why we’re proud to bring you the new Navigatr™ for NextBox. You'll get a new viewing experience which means less time searching for what you want, and more time enjoying your entertainment!

 

The one word that gets me is "proud". How can Rogers be proud to bring us something as bad as Navigatr? How can they be proud to bring us something that so many people are complaining about and that everyone who has received it wants gone? I am trying my hardest to stay with Rogers, but they are making it harder and harder to stay with them.

 

@BS I agree with @Datalink - Great post. I also agree with @Datalink about the Hitron Modems! 

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

Attila_
I Plan to Stick Around

Well, if Rogers is going to be pig-headed about this and just fixes the NB2 file loss issue and continues the rollout, I am just going to sit back and watch the fireworks on this forum - and perhaps some media (owned by a competitor) will pick up the story as well. <g>

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

Hcoates
I Plan to Stick Around
Who is the Rogers ombudsman and how does one contact him?

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

BS
I'm a Senior Advisor

@shan-man  To the ombudsman you go (off to see the wizard, the not so wonderful wizard of oz).  And next is Commissioner for Complaints for Telecommunications Services (CCTS). If I recall, you can actually skip the ombudsman as no other company uses the model of the ombudsman.

 

The only challenge to this whole process, is it is so complex. My experience is that notes on file are often incomplete unclear and missing important elements you have discussed and agreed.  Write down every discussion and decision made, and then have them read their notes to you. Correct them if needed, ask them to add "the customer requests the following additions - and tell them exactly what to right).

 

But you then go to Loyalty or customer relations, and do they read the notes - in my experience, not if you don't ask them to.  They say, what can I do for you, I say, open my file on screen and please read the following notes.  If you have dealt with multiple issues, even if they are resoloved, have them read those too in order that they have a perspective of what you have been going through as of late.  Then if not satisfied, you go to a manager. Again, make them read the notes and by the way before you leave the first rep, don't accept "I will get a manager and explain to them the details". I make them document what we discussed and why I have declined any resolution and why I escalating.  Again, have them read it back.  If they do talk to the manager, on transfer to you, ask them what they have been told from the last person, and to read the notes.  I refuse to repeat what I said ever again.  I just correct them if they misunderstand what they have read, and sometimes, I even have them read it back to me and ask what it is that they do not understand or how they interpret it that way.  Then if not satisfied, on to the Office of the President.  I have used the online concern once, but the problem is that if you get moving between reps on phone, to chat, to higher levels, and throw in written concerns too, you start to get lost. In addition, if you decide to send the note (be sure to cut and paste your text to a file you can retrieve, because once you click send, you can no longer read it.  Remember to do the same with chats online - make your own copy of it all.

 

Have never been to Ombudsman or the CRTC level, but I have been very close over the last month.

 

Best of luck in using the escalation process - it is a very draining process, very confusing, and many mixed messages are created and you are at risk of accepting something you are not happy with because you just can't take it anymore.

 

And this new process of discontinuing old services and when they offer something new that we don't fully understand, then their response is "Oh we can't turn that back on" is unacceptable.  Even windows has "roll back" built in because they know errors occur, and their software sometimes create unexpected things that you need to roll back in order to retain or get functionality back.  Why not build a 7 day grace period to allow us to see what we are into and allow us to roll back. And more importantly, why not allow rollback to occur until the end of the 30 days we have to notify of errors on the bill, or miscommunicated items that we were convinced was better and cheaper than what we had before, only to learn, nope, it is not cheaper, nor better, we have lost services we use and not have to pay more to get it back, lost discounts on the package or you just have second thoughts when you realize that you were sold something you really didn't want and the marketing pitch was so good that we got confused.  That is why governments built in grace periods to back out of big sales like cars, things sold at the door, etc.  Maybe the CRTC needs to force grace periods to back out of changes.  Only seems fair and would be good customer service (the customer is right sometimes and the seller is wrong sometimes, and in those cases, you should be able to back out without just walking away).

 

Just writing this process is tiring. going through it is exhausting. And why do I stay, I am beginning to question that in the last month.  I have been given a token compensation for the inconvience, but boy did I have to work for it. I won't say what it was, but for now it is acceptable, but I also warned them that they could close the other issues I was dealing with, but the issues related to whether one number works after September 15,2015, and whether this navigatr issue will be resolved in a way that is satisfactory to the customer, these items are not closed until I see what comes. At that time I may be back - I certainly hope not, but time will tell.

 

And as for being proud about their navigatr in what was written earlier, I have pointed out to each rep I spoke to, how does a company of rep be proud of their company when the box now has a nickname of garberator and other similiar description terms. I know I certainly could not say I was proud. I can't even say that I am proud to be a customer, and isn't that what is actually more important, not that the company is proud, but that we are proud and satisfied.  Just the opinion of a person, now retired, who has rolled out many a large system in my career and understands what customer satisfaction really means.  And most importantly, I was in health care. I mess up of this level of the new billing, and navigatr (those are the biggest issues that have impacted large number of us), in my business, you would be talking about compromising the health as my customers were patients, and the clinicians.

 

So I am going to be patient see what happens, and if I have to escalate again on this one, my next step is the Ombudsman and CRTC,  not looking for any compensation, just to make it clear what the issues are from this one customer, and the many others I speak for from this board, red board, and many other sources, that this is an unexceptable way to provide services.

 

Have a great day everybody.  I keep saying I am gone, but things come up that keep bringing me back.  I think I need to quit looking at the forums for a while.

 

Bruce

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

Hcoates
I Plan to Stick Around
Sounds like too much work to to deal with the powers that be at Rogers who clearly prefer to stick their heads in the sand rather than address the issues. I'm paying them, the are not paying me. I've been a customer since 1988 and have experienced the same frustrations as everyone else, but this takes the cake.

I spoke with Rogers last night to determine what I need to do to cancel my service and was told they were rolling out fixes at 2:30 am today. The person was not certain what those fixes would be but she did tell me what most of the complaints were. They included reinstating the list vs tiles, colour of guide, font size of guide as well as many bugs. Apparently the changes were not made

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

park
I'm an Advisor

 


@Hcoates wrote:
Who is the Rogers ombudsman and how does one contact him?

 

is the Ombudsman. Click on her TAG at the end of this message if you wish to connect.

 

I asked her the following question at the start of her her ill timed ASK AN EXPERT session a day or so after the JULY 28 fiaco launch of Navigatr.   No real answer yet, nor do I expect any from her.  Though she started out quoting the party line, over the course of  the 2 hour session, she started to respond as an ombudsman should as our advocate inside Rogers.

 

 

 

KIM:

 

If a company just put a flawed product on the market (i.e. New NAVIGATR) , what is its obligation to remedy the situation?

 

 

In this case, simply rolling back software (which is still  running on the majority of its customers PVRs) is an obvious, low cost remedy sought by its cusotmers.

 

What recourse do its customers should the company not effect a remedy in an acceptrable timeframe

(i.e. a couple days)?

 

e.g. Can they walk from any contracts with the company?

 

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

theClubHopper
I'm a Reliable Contributor

re: The Ombudsperson, Kim Walker - who conducted that "live chat" here on the forums 2 days after Navigatr launch:

1) she agreed with me that they should really have put on a company spokesperson that week who could answer Navigatr questions. The fact remains they didn't and they instead chose to put her out there, knowing that most customers were only  interested in venting.

2) I was told by someone in the Office of the President, "We screwed up on that and we had to apologize to her".

3) She has volunteered to host another session some time in the future.

Re: New Nextbox Navigator


@theClubHopper wrote:

re: The Ombudsperson, Kim Walker - who conducted that "live chat" here on the forums 2 days after Navigatr launch:

1) she agreed with me that they should really have put on a company spokesperson that week who could answer Navigatr questions. The fact remains they didn't and they instead chose to put her out there, knowing that most customers were only  interested in venting.

2) I was told by someone in the Office of the President, "We screwed up on that and we had to apologize to her".

3) She has volunteered to host another session some time in the future.


 

Ombudsperson (or less gender neutral Ombudsman) definition:

An official appointed to investigate individual's complaints against maladministration, especially that of public authorities. 

 

Apologies for what?  Doing her job? 

 

After that session and email torrent, the Ombudslady should have been putting the boots to the President with 3 short words.  FIX IT NOW ! 

 

 

PS to BS: No complex dialogues needed,

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

gregneff
I Plan to Stick Around

My wife and I have been away for a week.  It would appear that nothing has changed.  I have a new issue:

 

When pausing live TV, you see the progress indicator across the bottom of the screen.  There is a bar indicator that shows green at the start (the amount that has been recorded and watched), followed by light grey (the amount that has been recorded while on pause but not yet watched), followed by black (amount to ?).  This is followed by a countdown to ?  My wife paused many times, as she was running around unpacking and dealing with associated tasks.  After a while the green bar suddenly became much shorter.  A little while later the short green bar was replaced by a red bar followed by a green bar, both of equal length, the total length being about the same length as the green bar before it suddenly became short.  I have no idea what these changes are supposed to indicate.  All of this strange behaviour made my wife doubt the reliability of the recording, so she gave up on the show altogether. 

 

I completely fail to see the logic in or business case for forcing this mess on us.  Our position is still that Rogers has broken a box that is our property (we paid for it in full), and therefore Rogers needs to fix it.  We are still waiting, and we are not happy customers.  A free movie (as offered but not accepted) is not going to make us happy.  Fixing our box (reinstalling the prior software functionality) will make us happy. 

 

Our condominium Board meeting is a couple of weeks away, and the bulk contract renewal will be on the agenda.  At this point I can't see how or why I would want to be complicit in forcing this botched product on our owners.

 

Re: New Nextbox Navigator

How many condos (read: current Rogers clients) are in your building?  Just curious.