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Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

I own a modem cisco DPC3825 that works with the hybrid 60 and I want to change to hybrid 250. Rogers is telling me I have to use the CGN3ROG.  Is this the only modem that will work with the hybrid 250?

Futureshop and the best buy both have it for $199.99 Seems quite expensive to me.

 

 

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14 REPLIES 14

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

Datalink
Resident Expert
Resident Expert

Yes, that is the only modem that rogers has qualified to run at the higher rates.  Keep your eyes open for sales at Bestbuy as that modem does go on sale for $150 every so often.  And you might receive a gift card with that as well.  Keep in mind that your monthly rate will go down as well.  I believe its either $8 or $12. 



Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

Thanks for that info.

Rogers took over from shaw in Hamilton and had me swap out a modem that I owned for a modem that worked with their Hybrid 150 then charged me a rental fee. All the while the modem I had was working fine, though I don't think it was hybrid fibre. 

Long story short they made good and waived the $8.00 fee for the modem.

 

The difference between hybrid 60 + unlimited data and hybrid 250 with 500GB is about $5.00    

Rogers refused to waive the CGN3ROG fee or swap the modem they gave me for the CGN3ROG.

Which is why I made the enquiry. 

 

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

What did Rogers give you for a modem,  the Hitron CGN3 without the fee?  The difference is the number of downstream channels that each modem supports.  To run 150 Mb/s or higher on the Rogers network, Rogers permits the DOCSIS 3.0 CGN3 only, which is capable of 24 downstream and 8 upstream channels.  That permits 960Mpbs down although obviously Rogers does not offer rates that high.  The CGN2 only runs 8 downstream and 4 upstream channels for a maximum of 300 Mbps down. The DPC-3825 also runs 8 channels down and 4 up for a maximum of 340 Mb/s down and 120 Mb/s up. 

 

Although the lower tier modems can run high data rates, at least fast enough to support the 150 to 250 Mb/s download rates, you would end up with possible / probable channel congestion, running those rates on 8 channels down versus the 20 that the CGN3 currently uses.  At this point, you are in the realm of network planning and implementation and load balancing at the node level. 



Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

Rogers gave me the cisco DPC3825.

 

The system I was on before with Shaw which Rogers took over was not hybrid fibre and that is why they made me switch. 

Do you believe the Hitron CGN3 will be around for a while and is worth purchasing. 

Thanks for all your knowledge!

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

I hope it will be around for a while.  I bought one on sale from Bestbuy. 

 

The only hiccup in the plan are the number of customers reporting data downloads that can run into the hundreds of gigabits with the CGN3 and the CGN2.  Those amounts have no reasonable explanation.  The initial company reaction for the most has been "you must have a virus, or you're running torrents, or netflix".  There are numerous posts of that nature in this forum and others.  Customers have been successful in having the overages rolled back, and some end up on unlimited plans, at least temporarliy while the techs attempt to sort out what the problem is.  This problem is ongoing however, and there seems to be no long term resolution in sight. 

 

My advice, and same from other REs is to swap the modem on the theory of MAC address cloning, which allows someone else to download data, with your MAC address ending up as the billed modem.  Owning your own CGN3 might throw a kink into that plan, but I haven't seen a case such as that yet. 

 

So, all I can do at the present time is warn prospective CGN3 owners of this particular situation.

 

Just to note, the term hybrid fibre is really a marketing term more than anything else.  Unless you have Fibre to the Home, which Rogers is trialing, your "last mile" to your home, so to speak is copper cabling.  All ISPs these days run data via high capacity fibre systems, but, without a significant investment to replace the existing street infrastructure, it will remain copper for a long time to come.  Modem companies have made advancements in terms of the data transmission methods which has pushed up the capability to run higher data rates over copper.  The next generation modem, DOCSIS 3.1 will allow 10 Gbit/s downstream and 1 Gbit/s upstream.  This is currently undergoing testing in the U.S.  The one thing to remember is that in order to take advantage of those rates for the last mile, some portions of the supporting network would probably require physical upgrading.  So, its going to be an interesting future, but its going to take a while to arrive.



Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

Datalink to the rescue.. always seems to beat me to these threads latey 🙂

As he mentioned.. the NETWORK itself has not much changed.. its been fibre (or upgrade to fibre) for quite a while.. up unitil the last few miles.
They really just changed the name to combat bell FIBE (which people SEEM to thing is TRUE fibre but its not, it still just fibre up till the CO, then copper to your house)

 

Not knowing what your OLD modem was.. it could have been a Docsis3 modem (lesser channels) or even could have been a docsis 2.
The docsis 2 modems were single channel.. these are what in the end as more and more people sarted getting high speed in an area.. got slowdowns at busy times.. its like EVEYONE trying to use a one lane road at the same time.

Introducing the D3's.. they are multi channel... more lanes.. so less chance of congestion.

When you get up to the 150+ packages.. is where even the 4-8 channel might not be enough.  
Rumor has it, that SHAW is stoping its 150+ plans.. because of this.. (as they are NOT integrating a higher channel modem).

With the CGN3.. its one of the FEW 24 channel modem.. allowing the mose fredom of channels to avoid congestion.

 

That there are only.. 3, maybe 4 24 channel modems on the market right now.. i dont see them moving away from them any time soon.
(unless suddenly EVERYONE was getting FTTH)

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

Thanks again! That is a ton of knowledge.

 

I realize the term "hybrid fibre" is just a marketing term and they really pushed hard to change me from my "extreme unlimited" package saying I could not go back once I changed. They talked me into a package with a promo code U19 with a price of $103/month. That price has changed every month and every month I call to see what is going on. Of course they would not put back to what I originally had, they said that it was grandfathered in and I had lost it. My package "deal" is currently about $180.00 The promo also included a Nextbox 3 rent to own which is not compatible with the Hamilton system and I never got it.  I feel Rogers scammed me.

 

Ever since Rogers took over I have had problems, my internet speed seems to drop all the time and my cable freezes and pixilates. They have changed all the inside cable (made no difference) and ran a new temp line from their box which has made it 90% better.  

 

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

Out of curiosity, can you log into your modem when you have time, navigate to the DOCSIS WAN page, copy the downstream and upstream tables and paste them into this thread.  Those tables include the cable signal levels and signal to noise ratios, among other details.  If you are still having problems with your cable services, those tables might hold some explanation of what is going on.



Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

I don't remember the name or model of the old modem. 

Shaw made me purchase it for $100.00 in order to use their 100mbps speed.

A online tech said that the old modem would have work and there was no reason to change it.

 

I called to complained about my speed then found out Rogers took over and didn't offer 100 and put me on 60.

Then the problems started. Lol.

 

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

If you are thinking of going to the 150 Mb/s service, keep in mind the capabilities of your current devices and possibly ethernet cabling.  A good many devices including really new routers only contain 10/100 Mb/s ethernet ports, which caps your data rates at 100 Mb/s.  Home ethernet cabling in the walls is often only connected to support 100 Mb/s rates when it can be connected to support gigabit rates.  Purchased "Fast Ethernet cables" which people have owned for many years are also only manufactured to support 100 Mb/s.  Prior to higher speed data rates those cables served their puporse, but don't anymore.  So, unfortunately, its common to see complaints of slow service after someone decides to move up to the 150 or 250 Mb/s service.  When we start looking at the specs of the ethernet or wireless devices, the data rate limits of those components become visible, leading to a "good try, no cigar" type of moment.  Better to be forwarned when looking to move up in data rates.



Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

Power Level:    Signal to Noise Ratio:

Channel 1:        -5.9 dBmV       40.9 dB

Channel 2:        -6.6 dBmV       40.4 dB

Channel 3:        -6.9 dBmV       39.9 dB

Channel 4:        -7.3 dBmV       39.9 dB

Channel 5:        -7.7 dBmV       39.3 dB

Channel 6:        -6.9 dBmV       39.9 dB

Channel 7:        -7.4 dBmV       39.4 dB

Channel 8:        -7.5 dBmV       39.4 dB

 

                         

Upstream Channels                   

                       

                                    Power Level:

Channel 1:        44.7 dBmV

Channel 2:        45.0 dBmV

Channel 3:        44.5 dBmV

Channel 4:        0.0 dBmV

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

Ok, you have a temp cable in place at the moment correct?  The downstream levels are still low, they should be at 0 dBmV, the signal to noise is ok.  The upstream levels are high.  They are typically in the 36 to 40 dBmV range.  Thats a typical set of results when there is a cable or connector problem.  The downstream is low and the upstream goes up as the modem compensates for the cabling or connector issue.  If you are still seeing issues with your tv for example, pixelating, sound, etc, or with your internet, call tech support and have a tech come back out.  There might be more work needed upstream.  I would have thought with a temp cable in place, the levels would be closer to their normal levels.  Its possible that you might need an amplifier, which should take care of cable tv issues.  The internet levels are not amplified.  Or, possibly a higher grade cable is required, even on a temporary basis.  The signal ranges are 0 dBmV +/- 15 dBmV on the downstream and 36 to 51 dBmV on the upstream.  So, you are still within spec, but not where you should be.



Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

mrpete
I Plan to Stick Around

Yes you are correct there is a temp cable in place.

 

 

They have been out after I was still having problems and they say the readings are fine.

 

 

I called when I was having problems and asked the online tech what they see or what do I tell the guy that comes out because they always say the readings are fine.

The online person said the readings were "jumping" and the guy that came out said the online person can't see the readings.  

 

I was told the temp line is just temp and another line will be buried in the spring. Not sure if the buried line will be heaver gauge. 

Re: Hybrid 250 and CGN3ROG

Gdkitty
Resident Expert
Resident Expert

The people at the call center CAN see the readings.

I know they can see in the case of the modem, directly the same status screens that do.
They may have other tools as well.

I know the techs that come out, they have an app on the laptop, which goes back to.. SOMEWHERE in the rogers network, then tests the signal out to the devices, etc

(i have seen them use it.)

 

So it is different.

The one the tech uses, might just overall be a GENERAL signal strength, not across all channels type of thing, not sure.

 

 

 

The full cable they bury in the spring, will (or should be) higher guage/more shielded, etc.   Or its suposed to be.
In the spring, just make sure to be ontop of them.  Give it a few weeks once the ground is soft.. if you havent heard/seen anything (like no one out to mark the lines, etc under the ground), then give them a call and pressure them, make sure the apointment is made, etc.
There IS a specific cable bury department.

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